4-channel lp playback without the turntable

[stevecrozz]

I've come to the realization that my equipment is terrible. I'm sure this is everyone's dilemma, but I can't hear my 4-channel LPs and really enjoy them without good equipment and a lot of time fiddling around with adjustments and whatnot.

So my question is this: is there any way for me to legally obtain a digital copy of 4-channel copyrighted material without buying all the equipment and doing the conversion myself?

And secondly, does the answer depend on whether or not I have a legal liscense to the albums I want to hear? For instance, if I have a Pink Floyd LP is it legal for someone else to provide me with a digital copy of it, does that fall under fair use? What if instead of the actual LP, I have the media and liscense to use it in another format such as reel-to-reel, casette, or CD?

Anyway, I really want to listen to my favorite music in clear 4-channel sound. Is there any way to get around the initial high cost?

 

[roundhousequad]

Just like the rest of us buy the DVD A and the dts or the SACD of the lp you like and wait for it to be realeased. and wait and wait

We all have invested a lot into our systems players for dts, DVDAudio and SACD. five speakers, amps, decoders, you have to start somewere there are vary few short cuts and those shortcut the music.
good luck and spend some time reading the post on here you will learn alot.
And then you can make some educated choices. not just have people tell you what you should do.
Have fun its all about the music
Jim

 

[phydo]

Steve:

Visit TAB's website. There is a link on the QQ home page. Tab produces a quality product at a sweet price.

Justin

 

[stevecrozz]

I'll check it out, I have been reading quite a few of the posts, it seems like there are a number of hurdles to overcome. I can do it eventually, but I'm not in it for the challenge, I'm in it for the music.

I realize that most of the people here have spent a lot of money on their equipment, but that's why I think it should technically be possible to share what we all have especially considering some of you guys probably have records that just can't be found anymore.

I'll continue to pursue a great sounding system, but I just wonder why can't we put a few heads together and get some high quality digital audio that can be enjoyed by any number of us. Maybe there are legal blockages, but I think some of them have yet to be clearly defined including what constitutes 'fair use' of copyrighted material and intellectual property.

 

[Cai Campbell]

The golden question is "what constitutes fair use?" Laws differ and opinions differ and there is no clear answer. I can offer my own opinion, though, which does not necessarily agree with "the law." This is specifically in relation to acquiring DTS or DVD-A "backups".

If a title is totally out of print in any format, such that there is no commercial avenue for obtaining a current copy then I feel it is "fair game" to acquire as a DTS/DVD-A backup without owning any commercial media. However, should the title subsequently become commercially available in any format, I would feel impelled to purchase it.

If a title is commercially available then I feel one should own the media that most closely matches that offered by the DTS/DVD-A backup. For example, to justify owning a backup copy of the original quadraphonic DSOTM DVD-A, I own the current 5.1 SACD since it is the closest thing commercially available. Should a commercial release of the original quadraphonic mix come along, I would feel impelled to purchase it or discard my DVD-A backup.

I also feel it is fair use to own a DTS/DVD-A backup if you own media analogous to what was used in the backup process, regardless of whether or not the title is currently available. For example, if I owned an SQ LP of WYWH, I would feel fine acquiring a DVD-A backup without feeling the need to buy the current CD. However, if I all I owned was the stereo LP, I might not feel so justified.

Although less justifiable, I do think that it is sufficient to own any version, used or new, of the title in question to feel comfortable with owning a DTS/DVD-A backup of that title. Ultimately, it's about supporting the artist and the infrastructure that allows them to thrive, so buying something further up the food chain (i.e. closer to current commercial product) is what I prefer to do.

But hey, it's all just my opinion and in some cases it's probably illegal.

 

[JonUrban]

I agree with Cai. If you OWN a copy of a title in SQ, say, yet you no longer have your old quad system, then owning someone elses conversion of that Q8, LP, or Q4, to ME would be fine. Of course, I am sure others will say nay!

 

[Old Quad Guy]

I totally agree with Cai and Jon's assessment about the matter. As a musician I study intellectual property issues and this subject interests me very much. I'm also a hard core music fan and Record/CD collector just now adding DVD-A and SACDs. I've made money selling my music on apple itunes and it's good to finally get paid for my music. I also enjoyed the old napter and was happy to see one of my songs there. I didn't care. Before this copyright issue was settled I downloaded like a pig. But what I found in the end was I never listened to what I downloaded because I didn't care about the artist/music in the first place and the sound quality was lacking. If I really listen to an artist I support them by buying the product. I like holding product in hand. However it is also true one can't always find a recording that was never released or is no longer available. I collected my first bootleg record when I was 10. It was The Beatles "Get Back." When it was officially released as "Let It Be" I bought that record and forgot about "Get Back." I consider the Quad Broadcasts of the 70s a "fair use" release. I have an ad for a KBFH Boston show that reveals that it was being sponsored by Scotch Recording Tape! I got the recording but first I had to buy blank tape and do it myrself. I still have the tape. Stevecrozz be patient if you're serious about Quadraphonic music. I've been interested in Quad since I first heard about it as 4 track reels in the late 1960s, but I still don't have my CD-4 setup together (because of needle and cartridge) I'm embarrassed to say. If you want to hear Quad blues you have to pay your Quad dues. Which is not so hard when you consider how much Quad items cost at your local flee market. I found an off brand SQ decoder for 10 bucks without trying very hard that works quite well. For about $200 and a little luck you can find a nice Quad receiver and turntable on ebay. It's fun to preserve Quadraphonic music. When I find a Quad record or tape I enjoy preserving it myself, to see how well I can do it, and so that there's no wear and tear on the original media. When the movie "My Fair Lady" was being restored in the 1990s it was a collector who had Audrey Hepburn's original vocal tracks. When the movie was first released in the 60s the movie studio didn't care about the tracks and essentially threw them in the trash.

 

[ingresman]

I agree with Jon and Cai, but I'd go slightly further. I think if you own an album you should feel ok with a backup. For example I have LP DSOM, CD version and the SACD version, so I have no worries about tracking down the backup. Also I have LP and CD of WYWH so again I fell justified.
However If I didn't own any of these titles I'd feel less comfortable.
I know we all try to keep within the law and I think most of us will have more than made a fair contribution to record company profits along the way.
I also think that with the number of downloads and swaping going in would the record companies come after a max of 500 (??) personal users ?

 

[JonUrban]

Most of us from the "quad" generation are folks who want the "hard goods". I know I do. I would much prefer the actual disc or tape over a CD-R or data file of something currently available. Even if I come upon a CD-R or MP3 of something I don't own, or get a preview copy, once the real thing comes out, I generally go for it. Crap, I own the same titles in both SACD and DVD-A when they are available, just because I'm a collector-freak.

 

[roundhousequad]

I think I have most of mine in a least four formats must have 350 casettes 400 eight tracks about 375 quad 8 tracks and over 600 stereo lps and last about 230 quad lp's about 500 cd's then comes the dvda sacd dts. Any backups I have are just that, back ups of something I own. Some on hard drive that have never been burned, but not untill I have the original. Also we can't forget the music videos and concerts on tape and dvds.

Two members of my family are in the music biz and its important to support the artists, as they have been taken to the cleaners over the years and I would like to see more of them handling there own music insted of producers and record companies. I go to thrift stores and pay the price they ask if you constantly try to haggle them down and they end up not making any money when they close down - then there is no place to get a deal.

If the artist don't make any money, why should they make high quality music for us to enjoy?
I support local artists and buy their stuff directly from them, and some of it is very good. Others are working on getting better.

Now on the stuff that you will never find and the collectors that will never listen to it have it. Well there is the gray area - the music is supposed to be listened to, or what good is it?

 

[Quadgirl]

I think you should be patient, investigate the turntable stuff (I have a Marantz 4300 and the CD-400 demodulator and AT20 and 15 carts with proper styli and all work together nicely) and own the originals. Paul S. helped me over the phone to set up the tt, plus a setup record, and I was out of sandpaper hell in a matter of hours. And, I didn't know how to do anything with a turntable like setting the force thingy. I love DTS conversions (some of them are better to my ears than some SACDs and DVD-As I have - probably a weakness in my setup through two receivers), but I love to handle Q8s and albums and am regretting selling my RTRs that I never invested enough time in thinking the tapes just cost too much. I think you should have it all!! Just my humble opinion of course!
Quadgirl

 

[jaybird100]

Most of us from the "quad" generation are folks who want the "hard goods". I know I do. I would much prefer the actual disc or tape over a CD-R or data file of something currently available. Even if I come upon a CD-R or MP3 of something I don't own, or get a preview copy, once the real thing comes out, I generally go for it. Crap, I own the same titles in both SACD and DVD-A when they are available, just because I'm a collector-freak.

Sounds like me, too. This is an interesting topic to me because I back up my DVD-A discs on Dolby Surround-encoded CD-s. They're for my own use, and I will occasionally glean tracks from the many discs I've backed up to make a compatible stereo/surround demo for use at work when demonstrating surround systems. Played back using PL II Movie mode, it's amazing how much separation is retained. I've also transferred many of my favorite quad LP's to encoded CD's (an SQ encoder I was given works to encode CD-4
discs), and it's nice to play them without all the hassle of having to clean the records every time I play them, very carefully placing the stylus into the lead-in groove, and hoping I don't become a klutz while doing the above. I can play the discs in the car; when was the last time you tried to play an LP in a moving vehicle? To me, all of that falls under fair use. I don't distribute or sell my efforts. If the record companies have other ideas, they're based on pure greed.

 

[ingresman]

I was talking to a friend the other day about the moral and legal issues around conversions. He offered no real insight but what he did say was in 100 years time the people who have done this good work in preserving the Quad experience will be thanked in much the same way as with film archives now.