Pioneer DV-563A firmware campaign

[dabl]

There is NO video interview on the Alice Cooper "Billion Dollar Babies" DVD-A. It's an audio interview....

I'm responsible for this claim.

Hmm, I'll have to look again, maybe it does just say 'Interview'. In any case, the behavior that recall I experiencing trying to play it on my 563a is that I'm returned to the main menu. No matter what I do the interview won't play.

Are you saying you have successfully played the interview on the Billion Dollar Babies DVD-A on a 563a?

 

[dabl]

I just talked to a Pioneer service person and he told me that he got an e-mail yesterday listing the specific discs that were affected and also that a firmware upgrade is now available. I was told to go to my nearest repair facility or mail the unit back to Pioneer. He said that the service bulletin wasn't mailed out yet, so the repair facilities may not yet be aware of the problem.

George

Wow this is great news I really hope I can take it to my local authorized service center versus mailing it to Pioneer.

I called my local (Indianapolis, Indiana) authorized repair center (located via the Pioneer web site) and talked to a tech who said he hadn't seen the bulletin yet and hadn't heard about the problem.

Hopefully somebody will post when they find a local authorized service center that knows about it.

 

[dabl]

Wow this is great news I really hope I can take it to my local authorized service center versus mailing it to Pioneer.

I called my local (Indianapolis, Indiana) authorized repair center (located via the Pioneer web site) and talked to a tech who said he hadn't seen the bulletin yet and hadn't heard about the problem.

Hopefully somebody will post when they find a local authorized service center that knows about it.

Followup:

Summary: as of 04-02-04, 4-6 weeks for bulletin and part to reach service centers

http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/pna/article/top/0,,2076_3143,00.html

800-421-1404,2,6,2 (new case),<your phone number>,1

 

[cwellock]

I called Pioneer 2 weeks ago and got a Case#, but haven't heard anything from them since. I also got the "We have to go out and buy the discs and check for the problem" line, but the guy I spoke with didn't even sound like he understood what DVD-Audio was.

Today I called my local repair center and asked them about the firmware upgrade. They hadn't heard anything about it, but I left my name & phone number, and the person said they would check and get back to me.

We'll see what happens.

 

[cwellock]

OK, here's the latest-

My local repair center just called and said they checked with the main repair facility in New Jersey. They told her there IS a firmware upgrade available, but ONLY the main center can do it. Anyone with a problem would have to ship their player there. The address she gave me is-

Tom Killman
Pioneer
400 Broad Acres Dr.
Bloomfield, NJ 07003

I'm not exactly keen on sending my main DVD player to New Jersey for God knows how long, along with the very real possibility of damage in transit. I don't see why the firmware cannot be released to the authorized repair centers- if they trust them to do other repairs, why can't they do firmware upgrades?

Anybody have any suggestions?

 

[JonUrban]

Followup:

Summary: as of 04-02-04, 4-6 weeks for bulletin and part to reach service centers

http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/pna/article/top/0,,2076_3143,00.html

800-421-1404,2,6,2 (new case),<YOUR number phone>,1

The above link is for the early DVD Recorders, including the DVR-7000 which I owned and upgraded via DVD-RW disc. This "mandatory" upgrade is require to prevent the unit from being damaged by using 4x blank DVD-R discs.

This particular firmware upgrade has nothing to do with the 563A.

:-jon

 

[speedking]

Hi, just wanted to add a UK slant to this discussion. Over here the equivalent to the 563a is the 565a. I picked up one of these at the end of January. Until last week all I had was the Stones SACD's and the Floyd DSOTM SACD all of which play fine on the 565a.

Then last week I picked up the DVD-A of Neil Young's Greendale and ran into the same problem that is being talked about here.

I have spoken to some friends who have agreed to bring over some other DVD-A's to try out on my machine. These friends all have the same player although none of them have or are planning on getting the Neil Young disc. They do not have any problems playing any of the discs in their collections.

Just to note, the disc plays perfectly well in Dolby Digital mode, it's just the Advanced Resolution mode that delivers no sound despite the time running on the display.

I had to change the default setting to DVD-Video for the Audio settings AFTER inserting the disc. If you change it before putting the disc in, the player automatically detects the disc and changes the setting back to DVD-Audio.

Does any of this make sense?

 

[dabl]

The above link is for the early DVD Recorders, including the DVR-7000 which I owned and upgraded via DVD-RW disc. This "mandatory" upgrade is require to prevent the unit from being damaged by using 4x blank DVD-R discs.

This particular firmware upgrade has nothing to do with the 563A.

:-jon

I posted the link. It's the official Pioneer Service and Support page which lists the 800 number to call for information. You seem to be making an association with *another* link from that page for the DVR-310 software update. I'd agree that has nothing to do with the 563a issue.

--Don

 

[dabl]

OK, here's the latest-

My local repair center just called and said they checked with the main repair facility in New Jersey. They told her there IS a firmware upgrade available, but ONLY the main center can do it. Anyone with a problem would have to ship their player there. The address she gave me is-

Tom Killman
Pioneer
400 Broad Acres Dr.
Bloomfield, NJ 07003

I'm not exactly keen on sending my main DVD player to New Jersey for God knows how long, along with the very real possibility of damage in transit. I don't see why the firmware cannot be released to the authorized repair centers- if they trust them to do other repairs, why can't they do firmware upgrades?

Anybody have any suggestions?

Just an fyi, I confirmed from the aforementioned Pioneer Service and Support number that my local authorized repair center WILL receive the bulletin and firmware update for the 563a and that they WILL be able to do the work. As per the conversation I had with Pioneer, the local repair center must be authorized to repair DVD players to get the bulletin/firmware, perhaps that's the problem.

 

[JonUrban]

Oh, sorry. When I clicked the link, that was what came up. Since I had to do that upgrade, I recognized it!

 

[jimby]

I've found most manufacturers are very selfish/secretive when it comes to
firmware updates. I think this is partly because firmware can be used to defeat copy-protection and copyright mechanisms. I'm pointing my finger at bullies like the RIAA, the IFPI, ARIA, and 4C groups. If one of those bullies thought Pioneer was opening the door for firmware hackers, they could sue Pioneer for loss of revenue from copyright violations.
~jay

Sadly, you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. The only problem is that other readers might think that you do. Pioneer, by taking out a DVD-A license, agrees to abide by the terms of the copy protection license. The music companies have to take out a license with the 4C as well. Nobody is bullying anyone. Everyone wants the format to succeed.
Hardware manufacturers are not worried about violating their 4C agreement; they are worried that consumers might have a bad experience with a firmware update, thus damaging in their customer's eyes their brand name.

 

[KevinD9052]

DV563A owner here with two basic questions. Leading to many sub questions!
1. Does anyone know (or have an educated guess) as to what is involved with this "firmware" fix? What's involved? Pulling an IC and replacing it? Burning new ROM info on a chip? Or real surgery on the boards using soldering guns, etc.?
2. Why did this happen? Why do some of the newer DVD-As not play when older ones do? Why does this player and some others have problems with certain DVD-As? What's with those DVDAs that make them different? Wasn't the standard set when DVD-A was introduced? I haven't heard any similar complaints with SACD disks for this or other universal players. What gives here?

 

[oldsyd]

DV563A owner here with two basic questions. Leading to many sub questions!
1. Does anyone know (or have an educated guess) as to what is involved with this "firmware" fix? What's involved? Pulling an IC and replacing it? Burning new ROM info on a chip? Or real surgery on the boards using soldering guns, etc.?
2. Why did this happen? Why do some of the newer DVD-As not play when older ones do? Why does this player and some others have problems with certain DVD-As? What's with those DVDAs that make them different? Wasn't the standard set when DVD-A was introduced? I haven't heard any similar complaints with SACD disks for this or other universal players. What gives here?

Here's my best guess, but that doesn't mean I'm correct:

1. Pioneer hasn't told anyone what is involved to correct the problem,
and so far nobody has reported a service center with the necessary tools, so just sit tight. From past experience, a firmware update could be applied with a data disc, chip replacement, IR commands, or diagnostic port.

2. Again, Pioneer hasn't put the blame on any one thing, but I have read that there is some new DVD-A mastering software at the studio end that causes the problem.

I think it's a good idea for everyone to realize the goal was to get the problem fixed, so the player works properly with all media. I wasn't expecting anything above that from Pioneer.

As soon as the service centers start getting the tools and documents on how to correct the problems, you will hear about the results here, and get your 563 fixed.

I know most of us here are more technical than the average consumer, but to Pioneer, we are just that, and average consumer who wants to play our (insert problem disc here) on our new fancy Quad deck!

~jay

 

[KevinD9052]

My real concerns here are hardware and software integrity. If major surgery has to be done on my 2 month old unit I am hesitant about doing it. Authorized or not, service center repairs can be hit or miss with quality work. Hate having anyone playing around with a new piece of equipment.
On the software end, why should new mastering software affect the DVD-A format? It should conform to the limitations of the format. Unless the fault of ensuring full format compatibility belongs to Pioneer, what will happen down the line? Will future disks mastered with new software require similar upgrades? There are other units by other brands listed as having problems too. So who is at fault here? The equipment or disk manufacturers?
The DVD-A people should put the screws on whoever is at fault and get this resolved now. I'm not in the mood for yearly upgrades or settling for a unit that only plays older disks!

 

[oldsyd]

FYI, I updated the first post to include new info. Call Pioneer and tell them you would prefer a simple, firmware update disc versus taking the unit to a service center, or having to pay postage to ship it in. Pioneer told me today that there _is_ a disc created en route from Japan. Last internal Pioneer memo was sent out April 5th to tech support, so this thing is still not resolved yet. Also added link to story outlining tech details on the problem.

[The problem] "may be related to updated Content Protection for Pre-recorded Media (CPPM) data used upon the troublesome discs"

~jay

 

[rstamberg]

I received a letter from Pioneer that tells me to take the unit to a (somewhat) local service center for a free E-PROM update. Whether or not this is a hardware or software change isn't clear, but they did tell me to bring the letter to the service center (for some reason). They also tell me that I need to do this within 30 days -- I don't know why.

I'm holding off. I definitely don't want to be a guinea pig for this. I'd rather wait and hear about others' results first. I'm also still holding out to see if there will eventually be some sort of disc-based solution to this problem so I don't have to schlep my player around.

BTW, I called the above-referenced local service center today (4/8) and they said they "don't do updates," they knew nothing about the issue but eventually said to bring the letter and the unit in.

 

[rstamberg]

Just got off the phone with a very helpful Pioneer employee. They're much more aware of this issue than they were. Apparently there are only four Pioneer-authorized service centers in the US that can currently perform the E-PROM upgrade and there is currently no upgrade disc available to consumers. The Pioneer employee offered to pay to have UPS pick up and deliver my unit for repair. She also said that I don't have to do this in the 30-day time frame specified in the letter they sent me. She also said she'd put my name on a list for a disc-based upgrade should one become available. The latter is what I'm going to do.

All in all, it looks like Pioneer is stepping up to the plate on this one. Bear in mind this problem is not their fault -- it's the record companies and their ever-evolving copy-protection schemes that are at the root of this issue.

 

[KevinD9052]

The fix procedure seems to be evolving.
I called yesterday (4/8) and got a case#, etc. When I told the rep I wanted the firmware update disk instead of a trip to the service center, he told me no can do. The fix involved updating the flash memory which can only be done by a service tech if the unit is still under warranty. I didn't ask (but I should have) if doing it yourself with the update disk expressly voids the warranty. Anyway, the rep put me on hold for about 3 minutes and then asks for a phone # where I can be reached during the day. I gave him my work #. He told me I would get a call in 3-5 working days with instructions as to where to take my unit. He told me Pioneer would contact the repair shop, tell them about me and the problem and would send them a disk. I will be instructed to call the repair shop, verify that they got the disk, know about the problem and set up a drop off date.
Round and round we go.

 

[bobou2]

Hey Kevin...
Since I live so close to you (Bronx) can you keep me abreast of what they tell you where to bring your player. It would be very cool if we don't have to ship our players to the mid-west. PM me for my e-mail...
Thanks
Steve

 

[tcheb]

For those who live in Canada (ya know that big piece of land just above ya) I contacted Pioneer and a few days later they told me to ship the unit to a service centre in Toronto.

Crap!

I'll be deprived of my only DVD player for a few weeks I guess. The problem is that the 3 new Neil Young DVD-Audios which were released yesterday have already been reported with the same problem! So it looks like there's no other choice for a Neil freak like me...

Pioneer must really hate Neil Young though. Cause their player also won't correctly play the HDCD format which is Neil's favorite since 1995. Th ereceiver just won't recognize the HDCD stream when it comes out of this player. Some serious trouble with it.

Tcheb