Seeking a gapless DVD-As/DTS-CDs/SA-CDs disc player

[Scytales]

Hi.

I currently use an Yamaha DVD-S2700 disc player in order to play multichannel SA-CDs, DVD-As/DVD-Vs (audio only) and DTS-CDs.

Problem is, especially with DTS-CDs (of which I have many), that the playback isn't gapless : there are a few seconds between tracks when the sound is muted.

So, I am in search of a disc player with multichannel analogue outputs that is able to decode DTS CDs, DVD-As and SA-CDs and that does not suffer for this annoyance.

I would be glad to read testimonies of the forum members about their experiences of disc players. I am prepared to buy second hand.

The reason I want a more or less universal disc player with multichannel analogue outputs is that I use an analogue preamplifier that only have one single multichannel input.

Thanks for your input !

 

[LuvMyQuad]

You can't do better than a used Oppo. Do you need to play Blu-ray?

 

[SeeMoreDigital]

Problem is, especially with DTS-CDs (of which I have many), that the playback isn't gapless : there are a few seconds between tracks when the sound is muted.

How strange... Are these store bought DTS-CD's or ones that have been privately created?

Given that you are looking for a player with multi-channel analogue outputs, I presume you've set your current player to pass multi-channel PCM to your AVR.

Out of interest... What's the make and model number of your AVR?

Personally, I have a couple of dozen store bought DTS-CD's and have never noticed muted playback between tracks, not even on my first (oldest) Pioneer 'universal' (SACD, DVD-A, DTS-CD) player, which was connected via analogue (very pre HDMI).

 

[Scytales]

I do not yet play BR-Ds.

My concern is the behavior of the player with DTS CDs and other disc : do it mute the output between tracks or not.

How strange... Are these store bought DTS-CD's or ones that have been privately created?

Given that you are looking for a player with multi-channel analogue outputs, I presume you've set your current player to pass multi-channel PCM to your AVR.

Out of interest... What's the make and model number of your AVR?

Personally, I have a couple of dozen store bought DTS-CD's and have never noticed muted playback between tracks, not even on my first (oldest) Pioneer 'universal' (SACD, DVD-A, DTS-CD) player, which was connected via analogue (very pre HDMI).

My DTS CDs are all official releases.

As I have written in my opening message, I currently use the analogue outputs of the disc player plugged in the MC analogue inputs of a Vincent SAV-C1 preamplifier.

Do you remember the reference of your first Pioneer player ? Could be a good candidate.

 

[SeeMoreDigital]

Do you remember the reference of your first Pioneer player ? Could be a good candidate.

I think it was a Pioneer DV-575A, indeed the European models had a scart socket... I'm currently living away from home at the moment due to ill health so I can't check for sure.

 

[Scytales]

Thanks. I just check the service manual of that Pioneer : it uses a very common MediaTek MT1389 chip-set. Hopefully, any disc player with that chip-set would do.

If any other member know of other proposals, i would be interested to know !

 

[LuvMyQuad]

I use an Oppo BDP-83 SE. It plays DTS CD gapless. Prior that that I had a Pioneer elite 45a. It also played gapless.

 

[Scytales]

Thanks.

I should have precise that the optical pick-up of my current player goes backward for a second between tracks. The sound is muted at this precise moment. That's why the playback is not gapless.

 

[Owen Smith]

Thanks.

I should have precise that the optical pick-up of my current player goes backward for a second between tracks. The sound is muted at this precise moment. That's why the playback is not gapless.

I've used 5 different players for DTS CDs and none of them did what you describe, all were gapless. List is:

Marantz CD 63SE - CD player using coax digital out to Arcam AVR350
Panasonic A350 - DVD-Video player using multi channel outputs
Arcam DV137 - DVD-Audio/Video SACD player using multi channel outputs and coax digital out to Arcam AVR350
Oppo 95 - Universal player (except 4K) using multi channel outputs and coax digital out to Arcam AVR350
Oppo 203 - Universal player (including 4K) using HDMI and coax digital out to Arcam AVR31

I think your current player is faulty by design, it shouldn't go backwards between DTS CD tracks.

 

[barfle]

I know that RBCDs can be authored with a gap between selections, and that the player will show negative time countdown during that gap, assuming the player has that display.

My Oppo 105 plays all discs gapless, unless the disc is authored for gaps like I mentioned. Playing files from the network or USB leaves a gap on many formats.

 

[Scytales]

I know that RBCDs can be authored with a gap between selections, and that the player will show negative time countdown during that gap, assuming the player has that display.

My Oppo 105 plays all discs gapless, unless the disc is authored for gaps like I mentioned. Playing files from the network or USB leaves a gap on many formats.

That's exactly what happened with the Yamaha : the display show negative countdown between tracks while the optical pick-up is audibly going backward (or forward ?).

So, that's depend on how each disc is authored ?

If that's the case, I wonder if buying a "new" player would resolve the issue.

Those gaps are really annoying when listening to classical music or recordings with ambiance. Imagine the transition between 3rd to 4th movement of Beethovee 5th with a few muted seconds in-between. That's a pity.

 

[barfle]

That's exactly what happened with the Yamaha : the display show negative countdown between tracks while the optical pick-up is audibly going backward (or forward ?).

So, that's depend on how each disc is authored ?

If that's the case, I wonder if buying a "new" player would resolve the issue.

Those gaps are really annoying when listening to classical music or recordings with ambiance. Imagine the transition between 3rd to 4th movement of Beethovee 5th with a few muted seconds in-between. That's a pity.

I honestly don't know if a DSD or DTS or any other format has that option, because my software doesn't include those formats. A new player won't change how a disc authored to have the gaps would play, at least I seriously doubt it. I can make CDs and Music DVDs, which are not DVD-As.

I've ripped CDs that blend one piece into the next, and I have experienced the gap and yes, it's upsetting. My Marantz 7701 pre-pro will play gapless through its network connection, but it misses a lot of the other metadata.

 

[Owen Smith]

DTS CDs are red book CDs, except the digital data is DTS encoded rather than PCM. Dumb players don't know the difference and will play the DTS as if PCM which creates very loud noise like white noise.

 

[SeeMoreDigital]

DTS CDs are red book CDs, except the digital data is DTS encoded rather than PCM. Dumb players don't know the difference and will play the DTS as if PCM which creates very loud noise like white noise.

Yes it's clever... It's DTS audio placed within a WAV container. You can actually place Dolby Digital audio within the WAV container and create AC3-CD's too!

 

[Owen Smith]

Yes it's clever... It's DTS audio placed within a WAV container. You can actually place Dolby Digital audio within the WAV container and create AC3-CD's too!

It's not a WAV container, there is no such concept on red book CDs. There isn't a filing system on audio CDs it's just PCM audio data with error correction.

 

[atrocity]

Yes it's clever... It's DTS audio placed within a WAV container. You can actually place Dolby Digital audio within the WAV container and create AC3-CD's too!

Though in my experience some decoders won't work with 44.1kHz AC-3.

 

[Scytales]

I'm afraid I bought the wrong player.

I managed to found on a well known German forum some testimonies from people who complained about the exact same default with Yamaha DVD players of the same family as mine (use an online translator if you do not read German) :

http://www.hifi-forum.de/viewthread-48-10818.html
http://www.hifi-forum.de/viewthread-48-9909.html

According to one person who sent back the player to Yamaha at the time, the response was : "No firmware update will be released".

 

[SeeMoreDigital]

It's not a WAV container, there is no such concept on red book CDs. There isn't a filing system on audio CDs it's just PCM audio data with error correction.

I've made dozens of my own DTS-CD's and I always have had to place the DTS audio stream within the .wav container prior to authoring the disc...

 

[Owen Smith]

I've made dozens of my own DTS-CD's and I always have had to place the DTS audio stream within the .wav container prior to authoring the disc...

Yes but the WAV container is how you are providing the fake PCM data to the authoring software. By the time it ends up on the red book CD it is no longer in a WAV or any other type of container, it's PCM data on a red book CD. It's entirely possible to write authoring firmware that can take the PCM data in FLAC or ALAC or indeed any other filetype that can hold lossless PCM data.

 

[SeeMoreDigital]

Yes but the WAV container is how you are providing the fake PCM data to the authoring software. By the time it ends up on the red book CD it is no longer in a WAV or any other type of container, it's PCM data on a red book CD. It's entirely possible to write authoring firmware that can take the PCM data in FLAC or ALAC or indeed any other filetype that can hold lossless PCM data.

Indeed... Plus you also need to mux the native .dts, pcm etc stream into a container in order to play it in a software player

Personally, I tend to use .mka nowadays...