BD-A burned to a DVD

[Applewine]

Hi,

I was thinking about how an artist could release a lossless surround recording that would play on a stand alone player and not require a computer.

The problem with DVD-A is that DVD players are being replaced with Blu-ray players since they can play both DVD-V's and BB-V's as well as BD-A's. However the blu ray players do not play DVD-A's.

The only solution to this is to switch to BD-A. However this would require BD-R's which are quite costly compared to DVD-R's.

The solution to this with BD-V's has been to burn a BD-V disc to DVD, which is called an AVCHD DVD, which will play on most Blu Ray players that are recent.

My question is as to whether a BD-A burned to a DVD-R instead of a BD-R would play on a Blu Ray player as an AVCHD DVD does. This would limit the recording time and would probably be best to limit to 5.1 to save space.

Does anyone here burn BD-A discs?

Thanks

 

[elmer]

Hi,

I was thinking about how an artist could release a lossless surround recording that would play on a stand alone player and not require a computer.

The problem with DVD-A is that DVD players are being replaced with Blu-ray players since they can play both DVD-V's and BB-V's as well as BD-A's. However the blu ray players do not play DVD-A's.

The only solution to this is to switch to BD-A. However this would require BD-R's which are quite costly compared to DVD-R's.

The solution to this with BD-V's has been to burn a BD-V disc to DVD, which is called an AVCHD DVD, which will play on most Blu Ray players that are recent.

My question is as to whether a BD-A burned to a DVD-R instead of a BD-R would play on a Blu Ray player as an AVCHD DVD does. This would limit the recording time and would probably be best to limit to 5.1 to save space.

AVCHD can be burned as BD-A either with DTS HD MA or unpcompressed PCM - I have made many AVCHD discs with both - depending on the disc size requirements -either DVDR 5 or 9. Not sure about Dolby True HD but I'm pretty sure that it will work as well. I have 2 programs that can do this - MulitAVCHD is a freeware multi format authoring tool that can burn either Blu Ray or AVCHD - Cirlinca HD Audio Solo Ultra 4.1 will burn DVD Audio (non MLP only), Blu Ray and AVCHD (which is just Blu Ray format on a DVD R). Your only limitation is disc size requirements.

Thanks

Yes - they are the same thing - AVCHD can be burned using uncompressed PCM or DTS HD MA or Dolby True HD -depending on your software/capabilities. Audiomuxer can make a menu-less AVCHD. MultiAVCHD is a freeware program that allows for both BD & AVCHD authoring with menus and multiple streams. Cirlinca's HD Audio Solo Ultra 4.1 can do DVD Audio (non MLP only), BD and AVCHD with basic menus - all have their plus' and minus' depending on your requirements.

 

[LizardKing]

Creating AVCHD discs (on a DVDR 5) is a very inexpensive way of creating hi-rez discs for people that gives them a taster of what real surround music can be like. And of course they're playable on most blu-ray players.

AudioMuxer can create AVCHD discs too.

 

[Disclord]

Is there a bitrate limit for an AVCHD disc using DTS-HD Master or Dolby True HD on a DVD-R? Or can the same high bitrates as a 'real' Blu-ray disc be used? And what is the playing time limit for an AVCHD with, say DTS-HD Master and a 1080P image? If I remember correctly, the HD-DVD 'equivalent', the 3X DVD, was an hour of 720P HD video and Dolby Digital Plus.

 

[Applewine]

I wouldn't be doing video. Also the specs for AVCHD don't allow the right kind of audio according to wiki also AVCHD stands for video. Also I use Mac.

 

[elmer]

Are you asking or telling? The only limitation of AVCHD is the capacity of the disc - it is full BD - full DTS HD MA at 1080p. AVCHD is a video container but you don't have to put video content in there - it can be a blank screen if that is what you want. I have no idea what is Mac compatible - my only reference is PC

 

[mandrix]

I've put 70 minutes of DTS-HD 5.1 with video stills for each track on a DVD5. Comes in somewhere around 3.6 GB or so depending on the video resolution you encode to.

 

[Bob Squires Jr]

A lot of BD Players will not play AVCHD.
I created over 60 conversions with a single slide and titling but I used the Blu-Ray option, not AVCHD. (Two different codecs)
(Elmer is right, if you used just DTS-HD for sound, you wouldn't have to worry about it.)
I've used straight 5.1 PCM at 96/24 and DTS-HD at 96/24 5.1.
I also did a few stereo 192/24s straight PCM. Worked like a charm.
The compatibility rate is higher with BD and the files are not that much different than AVCHD.
You can write the BD files to a DVD +/- R and they'll work.
My only problem was on discs that are more than 4.5 GB... I haven't tried dual layer discs yet.
For those, I just wrote to a standard 25Gb BD blank.
They are getting cheaper, some less than $1.00 apiece.
I made a 4 hour DTS-HD disc on a 14Gb of tracks taken from DVD-Audio discs.
Great for parties!

 

[mandrix]

I'm curious now as to how many BD players will not play AVCHD. I had the assumption that most would, rather than most would not?
My Oppo does. But then, it plays anything.

 

[Bob Squires Jr]

I'm curious now as to how many BD players will not play AVCHD. I had the assumption that most would, rather than most would not?
My Oppo does. But then, it plays anything.

Both my Panasonic and my Magnavox will, but they are newer.
I have seen quite a few that won't... yet.
I believe, from what Neil mentioned, is that AVCHD was created for HD Cameras, which
was, of course, after the set tops were made.
Newer set tops will play them, but for better compatibility, I use the Blu-Ray encoding option.
I did a test one in AVCHD and one in BD to compare the file sizes ... not much difference.
The BD is a tiny bit larger, but not enough to make a difference with most conversions.
The ones that matter, won't fit no matter how you slice it unless you use a dual layer DVD+R.
(They do work too, by the way.)

HDDVD files recorded to DVD +/- R will play in HDDVD machines as well.
If the recorder has the decoding capability and looks at the files but not the disc type,
you can dump damn near anything to a DVD Blank.

 

[mandrix]

Seems likely then I should drop AVCHD and switch to BD for my conversions as for now at least I intend to stick with DTS-HD.
Easy enough to do with AudioMuxer.
Thanks!

 

[LizardKing]

.....
The compatibility rate is higher with BD and the files are not that much different than AVCHD.
You can write the BD files to a DVD +/- R and they'll work.......

I'll have to give the blu-ray option a go....I wasn't aware you could burn it to a DVD-+R!!!

FYI - I've used AVCHD because you can play the AVCHD structure on disc (USB) on my OPPO BDP-83... not sure you can do that with a blu-ray disc...

 

[Bob Squires Jr]

Some OPPOs play an ISO from a memory stick... I remember Neil telling me his OPPO plays the ISOs... Blu-Ray or AVCHD.
They are after all... Blu-Ray players!!

 

[mandrix]

Hmmm. I haven't tried to play blu ray through USB on my BDP-80. AVCHD, yes.
I have streamed .mkv with DTS-HD via media server to the Oppo but if I remember correctly it plays the lossy core dts.

 

[LizardKing]

Some OPPOs play an ISO from a memory stick... I remember Neil telling me his OPPO plays the ISOs... Blu-Ray or AVCHD.
They are after all... Blu-Ray players!!

Oppo 83s do AVCHD via USB, but not ISOs or BDMV...

The Oppo 93 & 95 do!!!! Wish I had a 95....

 

[mandrix]

I created a blu-ray folder structure with AudioMuxer (WYWH 4.0 compressed with DTS-HD) and put on a usb stick. My Oppo BDP-80 plays it, just have to click on the right folder and it starts right away. My Onkyo shows DTS MSTR audio.

 

[LizardKing]

I created a blu-ray folder structure with AudioMuxer (WYWH 4.0 compressed with DTS-HD) and put on a usb stick. My Oppo BDP-80 plays it, just have to click on the right folder and it starts right away. My Onkyo shows DTS MSTR audio.

OK - I'm going to have to try that.....

Just to confirm - do you "Mux to Mkv" and "export to Blu-ray" to do this?

Also what directory structure/folder do you use the "Blu-ray" folder or the "BDMV" (see below)??


BTW - The Blu-ray structure looks the same as the AVCHD structure (below):



I'll try the Blu-ray folders shortly....

 

[Bob Squires Jr]

AVCHD is only a codec... pretty much the same disc structure as BD but Blu-Ray uses the H.264 Codec.
File sizes are close as well but not all players will play AVCHD.
Many of the new ones do because of it's use in Camcorders now.

Audiomuxer is what I used.
Selecting output to Blu-Ray or AVCHD will create a Matroska (MKV) file.
It will then create the disc structure and then an ISO.
I usually play the MKV file to check and see if all of my titles etc are OK before I burn the ISO.

Burning either an AVCHD or a BD ISO to DVD is possible.
It just depends on if your BD player can play AVCHD.
I personally have found going straight out H.264 is currently compatible with more players
for the time being.
I've created over 65 BD discs from SACD & DVD-A both using DTS-HD and straight out PCM and they all work fine.
I even did a stereo disc using PCM 192/24 with no problem.

(I have also seen HDDVD files burned to DVD and they work fine as long as they fit!)

 

[LizardKing]

OK so whats the difference between AVCHD & Blu-ray from AudioMuxer???....

I couldn't play the "Blu-ray" folder on my Oppo, but if I rename it to "AVCHD" I can!!!!

As stated above the file structures are the same and the size of the folders/contents is identical.

AVCHD:


Blu-ray:


As you can see this is rip of Pat Metheny, created with 96/24 wav files from the DVD-A.

 

[LizardKing]

AVCHD is only a codec... pretty much the same disc structure as BD but Blu-Ray uses the H.264 Codec.
File sizes are close as well but not all players will play AVCHD.
Many of the new ones do because of it's use in Camcorders now.

Audiomuxer is what I used.
Selecting output to Blu-Ray or AVCHD will create a Matroska (MKV) file.
It will then create the disc structure and then an ISO.
I usually play the MKV file to check and see if all of my titles etc are OK before I burn the ISO.

Burning either an AVCHD or a BD ISO to DVD is possible.
It just depends on if your BD player can play AVCHD.
I personally have found going straight out H.264 is currently compatible with more players
for the time being.
I've created over 65 BD discs from SACD & DVD-A both using DTS-HD and straight out PCM and they all work fine.
I even did a stereo disc using PCM 192/24 with no problem.

(I have also seen HDDVD files burned to DVD and they work fine as long as they fit!)

Understand all this, but how do you play the Blu-ray disc structure for a blu-ray off USB.. on a Oppo 83?

Also as mentioned above the disc structures are identical.