Ugh, so to get discs 2-5 in Hi-Res, you have to buy the downloads too. They should have used a Blu-Ray ala XTC.
FLEETWOOD MAC TUSK DELUXE EDITION WITH 5.1 SURROUND DVD
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A CASH GRAB on Warner's part and unfortunately, WE are the victims. To wait ALL this time and be presented with TUSK in LOSSY 5.1 when an MLP DVD~A 5.1 master exists is pure hogwash........
If they could fit Solti's entire RING cycle in LOSSLESS stereo (16 discs worth) on a single BD~A, they certainly could've fit this entire TUSK package, likewise, on a LOSSLESS single BD~A and "call it a day!"
So I wonder how many promo copies (with marked out barcode) they hand out to people to sell on ebay....
A CASH GRAB on Warner's part and unfortunately, WE are the victims. To wait ALL this time and be presented with TUSK in LOSSY 5.1 when an MLP DVD~A 5.1 master exists is pure hogwash........
If they could fit Solti's entire RING cycle in LOSSLESS stereo (16 discs worth) on a single BD~A, they certainly could've fit this entire TUSK package, likewise, on a LOSSLESS single BD~A and "call it a day!"
While true, the issue with Blu-Ray is that it's definitely more expensive to author and replicate than DVD-V or even DVD-A/V, but I agree that there's still no excuse for the fact that it's just DVD-V with no DVD-A component to it, but this is no surprise. All three of the major labels have been screwing us over for years, sometimes never releasing a surround mix they commissioned, and then sometimes when they do, they stick it inside of an expensive item and sometimes not even in the best quality either! All I can say besides that is thank God for all of the great independent labels that really do care about our little niche market!
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While true, the issue with Blu-Ray is that it's definitely more expensive to author and replicate than DVD-V or even DVD-A/V, but I agree that there's still no excuse for the fact that it's just DVD-V with no DVD-A component to it, but this is no surprise. All three of the major labels have been screwing us over for years, sometimes never releasing a surround mix they commissioned, and then sometimes when they do, they stick it inside of an expensive item and sometimes not even in the best quality either! All I can say besides that is thank God for all of the great independent labels that really do care about our little niche market!
The real, sham, is that ALL of the discs in the TUSK set (including the DVD~V) were 'presumably' authored from 96/24 or 48/24 MASTERS....and as I refer to it...."dumbed" down for 16/44.1 and LOSSY DVD~V release. I'm sure these greedy major comglomerates are hoping to sell them as future hi res downloads which I'm sure garners a greater profit margin than producing expensive box sets.
And like ALL the TULL remasters (save for Aqualung), imagine the expense of commissioning Steve Wilson to remaster them from scratch in LOSSLESS 5.1 surround and then go ahead and release them in LOSSY DTS 5.1. If one listens to the 96/24 STEREO SW remasters on a good system.......it leaves the LOSSY 5.1 in the dust..... SO much more superior.
And these same conglomerates also have their motion picture divisions which are not only starting to remaster their back catalogues in 4K (a VERY arduous & expensive undertaking) but also include a LOSSLESS 5.1/7.1 soundtrack for a fraction of what they're charging for their music, only, remasters.
opcornYes, I, too, AM guilty of succumbing to these LOSSY 5.1 discs, as well, but REFUSE to buy TUSK in its present incarnation and will hold out for a LOSSLESS version down the road....whenever that is!
The real, sham, is that ALL of the discs in the TUSK set (including the DVD~V) were 'presumably' authored from 96/24 or 48/24 MASTERS....and as I refer to it...."dumbed" down for 16/44.1 and LOSSY DVD~V release. I'm sure these greedy major comglomerates are hoping to sell them as future hi res downloads which I'm sure garners a greater profit margin than producing expensive box sets.
And like ALL the TULL remasters (save for Aqualung), imagine the expense of commissioning Steve Wilson to remaster them from scratch in LOSSLESS 5.1 surround and then go ahead and release them in LOSSY DTS 5.1. If one listens to the 96/24 STEREO SW remasters on a good system.......it leaves the LOSSY 5.1 in the dust..... SO much more superior.
And these same conglomerates also have their motion picture divisions which are not only starting to remaster their back catalogues in 4K (a VERY arduous & expensive undertaking) but also include a LOSSLESS 5.1/7.1 soundtrack for a fraction of what they're charging for their music, only, remasters.
Yes, I, too, AM guilty of succumbing to these LOSSY 5.1 discs, as well, but REFUSE to buy TUSK in its present incarnation and will hold out for a LOSSLESS version down the road....whenever that is!
A few thoughts on your post:
1) The stereo mix of "Tusk" is included in the box on the DVD as full quality and lossless 96 kHz / 24 bit LPCM audio, so it's only the 5.1 mix that was (data) compressed to make it compatible with DVD-V spec.
2) The entire box is already available to purchase as a high-resolution download from high-res download providers, so the physical box is for those who like physical discs, 5.1 surround, vinyl, etc.
3) When it comes to Steven Wilson's work on these new reissues of classic albums, they are not simply REMASTERS at all. They are brand new REMIXES (both stereo and surround) from the multitrack tapes, whereas a REMASTER would simply be a new mastering of the original stereo mix (something that is also included in most of these reissues)
...All three of the major labels have been screwing us over for years...All I can say besides that is thank God for all of the great independent labels that really do care about our little niche market!
Years? Yes, indeed. It goes back to the vinyl days starting in the early 1970's when the stores were chock-full of lousy pressings. Remember when all the copies of Days of Futures Past were stamped off center? Then when CDs became hot, they cut corners and used Nth generation LP masters. Then when CD remastering became the fad, they started out OK but then succumbed to the loudness wars. Rant, rant, rant... :howl
...All three of the major labels have been screwing us over for years...All I can say besides that is thank God for all of the great independent labels that really do care about our little niche market!
Years? Yes, indeed. It goes back to the vinyl days starting in the early 1970's when the stores were chock-full of lousy pressings. Remember when all the copies of Days of Futures Past were stamped off center? Then when CDs became hot, they cut corners and used Nth generation LP masters. Then when CD remastering became the fad, they started out OK but then succumbed to the loudness wars. Rant, rant, rant... :howl
[Duplicate post. But it's a rant so I'll leave it in.]
But not Hi-Res (except for the main album of course).
So, the box is for people that like 5.1 or vinyl
The downloads are for people that like Hi-Res
If you like both, buy both, they say.
I'm very confused! So, I guess they mislabeled the DVD as "DVD-Audio" when it's NOT a true DVD-Audio (not capable of MLP). But it's really a DVD disc that has only audio! My question is on the 5.1 mix. I understand that it's DTS. But is it the 24/96 DTS which comes with both the core and the extended streams? Or is the just the regular lossy 16/44 DTS with only the core stream? The 24/96 DTS is rare. I've only seen it used by Monster in the past (but there could be others).
alk3997
500 Club - QQ All-Star
Let me (gently) correct a few things you wrote. For 5.1-channel audio, DVD-Video does not include a way to send lossless 5.1-channel audio. Even DTS 96/24 is lossy but it still sounds very good. The only DTS that is lossless is DTS-HD Master Audio which is avaialble on Blu-Ray .
DVD-Audio does not require MLP. MLP is only required if the lossless audio will required greater than 9mbps of bitrate. 5.1-channel 48/24 does not require MLP, for instance. But, DVD-Audio, whether PPCM or LPCM is lossless on the DVD-Audio side, which is stored in a separate folder on the disc.
DVD-Video is lossy for 5.1-channel. There have been quite a number of DVD-Audio discs that have included DTS 96/24 in the DVD-Video folder that is playable with DVD-Video only players (such as those made by Sony).
I didn't want you to think that just because the disc has DTS 96/24 means you are getting a DVD-Audio disc.
Andy
Hi Andy, thanks for the clarification. I do understand that DTS is lossy (even the 24/96 with the extended streams). DTS-MA is not lossy, but only available on Blu-Ray, so since this release is on a DVD, it is not DTS-MA. I'm just wondering if the lossy DTS on this DVD is the 48khz or 24/96 with the extended streams. They are both lossy, but the DTS 24x96 is "presumably" better than the standard core DTS. Just wondering which is on this DVD.
And thanks for clarifying the MLP for me!
DTS can be 24bit on DVD - 16/44 is usually DTS-CD.
Didn't someone already confirm its 24/96 on the Tusk DVD?
Didn't someone already confirm its 24/96 on the Tusk DVD?
It shows DTS 5.1 96k on my OPPO.... And I just hit a track with the drum anchored in the center channel. Interesting mix!
Seems to me that 16/44 would be less lossy than 24/96 since 24/96 would have to be more lossy since there's more data (music) they have to get rid of.
If Oppo shows it as 96k, then it's 24x96 DTS. That's what I needed to know. Thanks!
And those can be a pain to rip if you wanna put it on a file server. Most methods will fail at extracting the extended channels and only rip the core DTS (48khz, not 96). It's my understanding that Audiomuxer may be capable of ripping a 24x96 DTS with it's core and extended tracks.
Well this is last time I order a bigger item from a non Canadian seller as they did put this thing in a huge box with a little bit of packing(wouldn't have helped at all) and guess this is why I got hit with the extra duty tax as it wasn't the price of the item as it came in around $78(have had things shipped over $100,no duty), so extra $19 duty and this was almost $100 for a single disk that I wanted and its lossy to boot.
Really quick delivery on this one all the way from amazon.uk to here in a couple of days.
This would be the title I got one of my kids to pay for as a Christmas present, so can't even open it up and look at it as that was part of the knowing what the Christmas present deal I made.
I know,I know, what am I complaining about as its a Christmas present but not sure why but paying extra duty on items and having to pay for parking are two of my pet peaves of this is taking it to far in extra fees that one is hit with.
Any other Canadians getting hit with the duty monster on this one?
peter
Really quick delivery on this one all the way from amazon.uk to here in a couple of days.
This would be the title I got one of my kids to pay for as a Christmas present, so can't even open it up and look at it as that was part of the knowing what the Christmas present deal I made.
I know,I know, what am I complaining about as its a Christmas present but not sure why but paying extra duty on items and having to pay for parking are two of my pet peaves of this is taking it to far in extra fees that one is hit with.
Any other Canadians getting hit with the duty monster on this one?
peter
Sound of the mix? Sound quality in general?
There is something slightly muddy about the sound, but certainly the album sounds better than I have ever heard it. This is a very discrete and at times a bit unorthodox mix. The vocals at times might be a touch buried. Overall, I am pleased.
Peter, I'm having a hard time ordering this for $100 since it's lossy surround. And there are still a lot of unanswered questions. HDTracks has the 5 disc set for $70 (the new 2015 version, not the older 2011). And it's all 24x96 rather than the 16x44 on the CD's. Were these originally in 24x96 and then downsampled for the CD (I know the mastering is usually done in 24x96)? And does HDTracks have the original 24x96? Or did HDTracks just upsample from the 16x44 CD? And the DVD does contain the 24x96 stereo tracks, but is it all the tracks from the 5 CD's? Or just a few selected tracks?
And they are clearly (and mistakenly in my opinion) calling this DVD-A. Which at the very least is misleading.
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