YES - Tales From Topographic Oceans 5.1 - Reality

[DennisMoore Jr.]

Welcome back my friend! So good to see you back. I'm in lurker mode more often than I post, so no great surprise when I disappear, but you being absent right before this release had many of us a bit worried. So glad you're doing fine. Better than that- sounds like Tales has had it's intended effect on you and you've reached a state of spiritual elevation! So caught up in emotions initially that you forgot to change AVR settings and didn't notice right away; I can only assume a higher power intervened to give you a gradual ramp-up to the heights to keep your head from exploding. :sun (Nous somme du soleil!)

I'm sure you'll soon post your great review in the poll section, so no one misses it. So glad that you got yours quickly- if anyone deserves that, it's you. Me, I'm being tutored on how to practice patience, not one of my strong points- but at least mine shipped; many who pre-ordered are still awaiting a shipping notice. I like your new avatar and it's very fitting, but I prefer that gorgeous lady w/ the appropriate shirt.

So great to have you back!

Mine got here last Wednesday because I wrote to Sirendurai @Headphone Dust and begged endlessly, for weeks beforehand. My only time behaving in such a fashion.

Sorry yours hasn't arrived. Where did you order it from? I always order from Steven Wilson's Headphone Dust so to show Steven my support. We mustn't take these 5.1 releases for granted so every time Steven Wilson releases one, there I am to say. Well done lad, now get on with it! Just to make conversation, Headphone Dust has a unique shipping cost policy that may confuse people. They charge perhaps a flat rate in the beginning but then they refund you the difference to show actual costs. I ordered first and paid a 10 English pound shipping & insurance costs. Later I was issued a credit to my card at over 7 pounds, so the actual cost was 2 pounds and a few pence... I would have happily paid the greater amount to show Steven my support, but I didn't need to. In the end, it was standard shipping prices. blah, blah, blah...

You are gonna freak out when you get your copy. It is everything we expected and way more. The new 2.0 mix is just as welcomed as the 5.1 and it BLOWS AWAY all prior 2.0 releases.

 

[ProgRules]

Mine got here last Wednesday because I wrote to Sirendurai @Headphone Dust and begged endlessly, for weeks beforehand. My only time behaving in such a fashion.

Sorry yours hasn't arrived. Where did you order it from? I always order from Steven Wilson's Headphone Dust so to show Steven my support. We mustn't take these 5.1 releases for granted so every time Steven Wilson releases one, there I am to say. Well done lad, now get on with it! Just to make conversation, Headphone Dust has a unique shipping cost policy that may confuse people. They charge perhaps a flat rate in the beginning but then they refund you the difference to show actual costs. I ordered first and paid a 10 English pound shipping & insurance costs. Later I was issued a credit to my card at over 7 pounds, so the actual cost was 2 pounds and a few pence... I would have happily paid the greater amount to show Steven my support, but I didn't need to. In the end, it was standard shipping prices. blah, blah, blah...

You are gonna freak out when you get your copy. It is everything we expected and way more. The new 2.0 mix is just as welcomed as the 5.1 and it BLOWS AWAY all prior 2.0 releases.

I appreciate your willingness to show support for the maestro! Glad that they seem to appreciate it at HD too and sent you an early copy. My current financial situation is such that I need to find the best deal possible (and also forego many releases I'd love to have), so I went w/ Deep Discount. I was happy when they shipped a day before release, but they also use USPS, whose tracking service is tortuous. Here's what shows currently- the same as yesterday:

October 8, 2016 ,
3:14 pm
Departed Shipping Partner Facility, USPS Awaiting Item

Your item departed a shipping partner facility at 3:14 pm on October 8, 2016 in HEBRON, KY 41048. This does not indicate receipt by the USPS or the actual mailing date.

October 6, 2016 ,
9:51 pm
Arrived Shipping Partner Facility, USPS Awaiting Item

Very little info and I don't know why it took 2 days to depart from the shipping partner, but I'm sure it didn't help that there was a holiday weekend. I wouldn't be surprised to actually get it before that tracking shows it as being received by USPS. Whatever- I've been waiting for this ever since being blown away by SW's CttE, then having it delayed indefinitely and even possibly cancelled... I can stand a few days and like I said, patience is something I need to work on anyway...

But it's great hearing your and others' reviews. I was worried that my expectations may have been too high, but that worry has vanished, leaving just anxious anticipation. I look forward to being transported out of mere existence into the glories of Astral Traveling by the experience of SW's 5.1 mix. What makes the wait even harder is my usual practice of a self-imposed moratorium on the album once the deluxe edition is announced. I've always held CttE as my all-time fave album, w/ Tales a close 2nd (though I've often wondered, if they're that close, and Tales has twice the music, maybe that should be #1); this 5.1 mix might just push Tales into that spot. Regardless, I know the experience will be incredible.

I haven't seen too many specifics in reviews- other than the slightly different edit used for Squire's bass in Ritual (and the missing run-through)- but I've always imagined that the Ancient would be the most mind-blowing track in surround, even though sides 1 & 4 have always been my faves. As much as I love some of their later work, I think this album was Yes' peak in reach and execution. What some consider padding, I consider pacing and dynamics. I think had it not been for Rick's negative reactions, along w/ the press and some of the fans, Jon and Steve would consider this their masterpiece of composition. I have a feeling Jon does anyway, he's just afraid to admit it. I've read that when he first met Jane, she was playing this album at her house and the rest was fate.

I'm hoping for tomorrow, but as long as it gets here by this weekend, I'll stay sane (or at least not lose any sanity I have remaining). I'm looking forward to some great musical times: 1st this, then before I can come down from my Tales high, next weekend my fave local band is playing (they cover Dead, Airplane, Dylan, etc.) along w/ another Dead cover band, who I've also seen before, so I'll be trippin' the Light Fantastic for a while...

 

[Frogmort]

Glad to hear you're enjoying it Dennis. Somehow I knew you would.

And to ProgRules, I feel you man. Check this out, I just now went to my mailbox and lo and behold, there was a rather large package that was just the exact size and I knew it had arrived, as I have nothing else on the way. A big smile crawled across my face and I actually yelled out 'YES!' and got that roller coaster ride sensation in my stomach. Then I flipped the package over and the label had my next door neighbor's name on it, and it said '60 count 2-quart freezer bags'!!! :scream I feel like the universe is playing some kind of cosmic joke on me right now.

 

[ProgRules]

Glad to hear you're enjoying it Dennis. Somehow I knew you would.

And to ProgRules, I feel you man. Check this out, I just now went to my mailbox and lo and behold, there was a rather large package that was just the exact size and I knew it had arrived, as I have nothing else on the way. A big smile crawled across my face and I actually yelled out 'YES!' and got that roller coaster ride sensation in my stomach. Then I flipped the package over and the label had my next door neighbor's name on it, and it said '60 count 2-quart freezer bags'!!! :scream I feel like the universe is playing some kind of cosmic joke on me right now.

That's just cruel! To have it in your hands and then get it snatched away- that's much worse than just bearing the wait. Ouch!

TBH, I'm surprised at how patient I've been. The worst part is the frustration of checking the tracking several times a day only to have just 2 updates in 6 days. I was much more of a wreck when the CttE Deluxe got delayed last minute; it didn't help that Amazon actually sent me a shipping notice and a specific delivery date, but the day comes and no package- only upon calling them did I hear the release was pushed back. They couldn't explain why I got a shipping notice, but were conciliatory and when I countered their offer of a $5 credit w/ a desire to be upgraded to next day shipping, they accepted.

I think the fact that just a few months ago we didn't know if we'd ever get this makes it easier for me to wait a few days. Here's hoping we both get some Tale(s) tomorrow!

 

[~dave~~wave~]

A minor quibble, but the Latin expression reductio ad absurdum (reduced to the point of impossibility) applies to the gatefold liner notes and lyrics on the CD sleeve.

Replicas of 12" vinyl covers are cute, but hard on a old guy with bifocals.
Chicago Quadio, same.
My budget Atlantic jazz cds are readable only because they're black on white in a non-arty-farty type face.

Even with a high-res scan or document camera, print minified to such an extreme can't be restored.
A shame scans couldn't have gone on the blu-ray disc, if not printed on a folded poster at original size.
There are numerous of examples of well-done re-issue packaging.

My trusty flip-up magnifier visor is getting a work out, and I'm getting a headache.
For the rest of you, I hope they perfect cyber eyeballs by the time you need them.

 

[Frogmort]

That's just cruel! To have it in your hands and then get it snatched away- that's much worse than just bearing the wait. Ouch!

TBH, I'm surprised at how patient I've been. The worst part is the frustration of checking the tracking several times a day only to have just 2 updates in 6 days. I was much more of a wreck when the CttE Deluxe got delayed last minute; it didn't help that Amazon actually sent me a shipping notice and a specific delivery date, but the day comes and no package- only upon calling them did I hear the release was pushed back. They couldn't explain why I got a shipping notice, but were conciliatory and when I countered their offer of a $5 credit w/ a desire to be upgraded to next day shipping, they accepted.

I think the fact that just a few months ago we didn't know if we'd ever get this makes it easier for me to wait a few days. Here's hoping we both get some Tale(s) tomorrow!

It's actually almost funny to me now, but wasn't at all at first. Also, based off my last shipment from BS it probably won't be here until at least Friday, so maybe I should've been more skeptical about it, I guess. Unfortunately (or maybe fortunately) I didn't get any tracking info, I just beg/pray and then open the mailbox every day.

Also, I'm not sure if the long gestation period and uncertainty of this release necessarily makes the wait any easier.

 

[jefe1]

ITS ARRIVED!
I ordered from deepdiscount. I'm off to the gym but tomorrow night I'll be swimming in the ocean....

 

[ProgRules]

ITS ARRIVED!
I ordered from deepdiscount. I'm off to the gym but tomorrow night I'll be swimming in the ocean....

Wow- that's some commitment to working out. It will be a matter of minutes from in my hands out of mailbox to into the Oppo. Congrats!

 

[ProgRules]

A minor quibble, but the Latin expression reductio ad absurdum (reduced to the point of impossibility) applies to the gatefold liner notes and lyrics on the CD sleeve.

Replicas of 12" vinyl covers are cute, but hard on a old guy with bifocals.
Chicago Quadio, same.
My budget Atlantic jazz cds are readable only because they're black on white in a non-arty-farty type face.

Even with a high-res scan or document camera, print minified to such an extreme can't be restored.
A shame scans couldn't have gone on the blu-ray disc, if not printed on a folded poster at original size.
There are numerous of examples of well-done re-issue packaging.

My trusty flip-up magnifier visor is getting a work out, and I'm getting a headache.
For the rest of you, I hope they perfect cyber eyeballs by the time you need them.

It's an unfortunate by-product of those small silvery discs that we often get illegible print in the liner notes/booklets. I can understand why reprints off an album would often be hard to read, but I don't understand some of the formatting choices for new material. Using colors and fancy fonts might look nice, but don't they care that it's illegible? I like your idea of putting scans on the disc. They couldn't take up that much space and wouldn't be that hard to do (I imagine- not that I've ever done such a thing).

I'm glad I've got my LP to appreciate all the album art, lyrics and notes for Tales. But that material at the bottom of your nice pic looks like it'll be a tough read- though at least the one on the right is black on white.

 

[Simon M]

...the TFTO Blu-ray set is currently sold out at Amazon UK I see.. already.. wow! :yikes

I don't think they've had any yet Fred. I pre-ordered in September and was expecting it last Friday, when I checked it said 'Temporarily out of stock', I even rang them yesterday but they had no explanation. I may have to cancel and get it elsewhere now after all of the reviews I'm reading. I may be fortunate in that I've never heard the album before so it should be fun!

 

[colsky]

I don't think they've had any yet Fred. I pre-ordered in September and was expecting it last Friday, when I checked it said 'Temporarily out of stock', I even rang them yesterday but they had no explanation. I may have to cancel and get it elsewhere now after all of the reviews I'm reading. I may be fortunate in that I've never heard the album before so it should be fun!

Where I bought it from it still says available, and for only £22.99. So if you're fed up with Amazon and the waiting:

http://www.base.com/buy/product/yes...s-3cd-1blu-ray-music-cd/dgc-0633367901026.htm

 

[Failed Muso]

I don't think they've had any yet Fred...

I pre-ordered mine from Amazon UK at the beginning of August and got it on release day, so they've definitely had stock

 

[colsky]

I think I've discovered a major flaw in this otherwise fine release. The track titled "Dance of the Dawn (Studio Run-Through)" is no such thing. It is simply a remastered version of "The Revealing Science of God" from the Rhino TFTO CD. I even lined the two versions up in Adobe Audition and they stay in perfect sync from start to finish. This is true for both the CD and the blu-ray. The Rhino TFTO actually has the studio run through, so I know what it's supposed to sound like.

If I am right (and maybe I'm comparing the wrong tracks), I am somewhat surprised by this.

I've just seen on SH a quote from Burning Shed/Panegyric explaining the wrong tracks issue, which appears to be actually errors in the booklet, rather than on the discs.

And I've just noticed that this is my 1000th post :brew


Declan Colgan from Panegyric Recordings has asked us to pass this message on to you regarding this edition of Tales From Topographic Oceans.
A number of comments about Tales From Topographic Oceans CD2 & Blu-Ray have been brought to my attention in the last day or two which need to be addressed.

1) I tested these discs & I personally approved all of the content on them.

2) There are no "defects" on these discs. However, some decisions taken in the final days of mastering are inaccurately represented in the printed copy of the booklet & the disc labels. These will be addressed & altered in any future pressings.

3) When the authoring process of this album was started, with Neil Wilkes at Opus, we were confident that a 50GB dual layer disc (actually 45GB of usable space) would hold all of the music I wanted to include. This was the same point at which final authorisation was being given for the artwork. On that basis, I listed all material at 24/96.

4) When the final numbers were added up, it became clear that we would run out of space. A simple decision was required with choices: remove some material - needle drops (for example), include the (amazing sounding, in my opinion) original master not at 24/192 but at a lower 24/96 bit rate (again, a compromise I rejected) or, retain all material with the 'lesser quality' (in terms of original source audio) included at 24/48 resolution.

5) I took the decision to allow the latter material to be included at the lower rates.

6) I also took one further decision. When a suitable source file for the "studio run-through" (actually an early rough mix) of "Dance of the Dawn" from the Rhino 2003 remaster couldn't be found, I opted instead to include the better sounding "Dance of the Dawn" final mix from the same edition.

7) In the rush to meet all of the deadlines involved, I neglected to get the artwork altered. Simple error.

8) Both mixes, Steven Wilson's 2016 mix of "Dance of the Dawn" & the Rhino 2003 master are included on the discs.

Claims that the two tracks are 'merely repeats' are, factually, incorrect.

9) All of the key material: all 2016 Steven Wilson mixes; stereo, 5.1, singles edits & instrumentals - are included, as mixed, in 24/96 with no compression, mastering or alteration to that which emerged from Steven's studio. The original master is presented - again, with no compression, mastering, or alterations from the source transfer at 24/192. The additional material, a full album of alt takes & two full album needle drops, is included at 24/48.

Again, claims that the original master transfer appears at 24/48 are, factually, incorrect.

I'll happily apologise for the misprints in the booklet. But the discs are not defective in any way & I stand by the claim that this is the best sounding & most comprehensive presentation of this album to date.

 

[jaypfunk]

I think maybe the Burning Shed reply saying that the booklet is "wrong" because of last minute changes and that all the content is actually correct was the easy way of not having to replace the discs?? They may have had a "OH FUCK" moment and had to deal with it that way because of business.

Think about it... Replacing so many CDs, BluRays and DVDAs would be very expensive for them to have to do at this point and they would take a bath on it.

I'm fine with it though. The 5.1 mix is so fucking incredible and that has zero issues. and look at point 9) in the statement. That's alot of content and KILLER extras. The DOTD run-through is easily available to anyone that doesn't already have it.

 

[ProgRules]

I think maybe the Burning Shed reply saying that the booklet is "wrong" because of last minute changes and that all the content is actually correct was the easy way of not having to replace the discs?? They may have had a "OH FUCK" moment and had to deal with it that way because of business.

Think about it... Replacing so many CDs, BluRays and DVDAs would be very expensive for them to have to do at this point and they would take a bath on it.

I'm fine with it though. The 5.1 mix is so fucking incredible and that has zero issues. and look at point 9) in the statement. That's alot of content and KILLER extras. The DOTD run-through is easily available to anyone that doesn't already have it.

I think you're probably right about the run-through, but that explanation makes perfect sense about the switch from 96 to 48. Regardless, as you said, what really matters is so fantastic, these minutia are inconsequential.

 

[ProgRules]

I've just seen on SH a quote from Burning Shed/Panegyric explaining the wrong tracks issue, which appears to be actually errors in the booklet, rather than on the discs.

And I've just noticed that this is my 1000th post :brew

Congrats on 1000 and also having the milestone be a very significant post!

And as long as we're quoting "that other forum" here's a post that I feel boils it down to what really matters:

Not only do I accept Declan C. explanation but if he is reading this want to thank him for making all these releases possible. If it wasn't for people like Declan C. we wouldn't even be talking about these Yes/XTC,King Crimson releases and we would all be the poorer for it as these have been some of the most amazing music releases we have ever received. Think about it for a minute, look at all the other music releases as of late and most of them are in super expensive boxsets that cost you $100 or more to get the type of content we are getting in these reissues at a fraction of the cost and all we get on these releases is a Bluray that is crammed till there is no more space left so that us customers literally get hours and hours of listening pleasure. I have yet to find a reissue program that has given me as much joy as the Yes/King Crimson/Xtc reissue's, they have given me way more pleasure than I could have imagined when I first started my own music listening hobby some 40 years ago.

I think there would have been a way bigger revolt if there had been a month or 2 month delay on this release to correct a few things in the booklet.
I thought this was a music listening hobby that we all share here, I am just floored that people are now complaining about a few things in a booklet when you get so much amazing music on this release.
To me I have never spent more than one or 2 looks through any booklet ever compared to countless hours listening to the music as that is why I buy these releases in the first place, for the MUSIC.

Even if these are not actually just booklet mistakes but actual errors they are "covering up," the point remains valid. And not only should we be grateful for all the great releases we've had from Panegyric, it's my belief that they helped keep surround music alive at a time the industry had turned their back on it (thanks to the way they fouled up the launch) and if not for their courage to delve into a field deemed unprofitable, we wouldn't have a lot of the other surround releases that have appeared since, nor would we be experiencing the current surround renaissance we are now so happily enjoying.

 

[milt]

Agreed.
I think the explanation is totally logical & believeable.
The faux outrage machine on SHF is typical.
I'm guessing QQ member ProgRules is the person on SHF futilely making the case for reason in the reaction to the TFTO news.
I appreciate your POV.
I've tried in the past to make the same case for certain releases but gave that up a loooong time ago.

Also the guy that said he got banned from QQ for merely saying that Red was "slightly compressed" is to put it accurately, lying.

 

[colsky]

Congrats on 1000 and also having the milestone be a very significant post!

And as long as we're quoting "that other forum" here's a post that I feel boils it down to what really matters:

Not only do I accept Declan C. explanation but if he is reading this want to thank him for making all these releases possible. If it wasn't for people like Declan C. we wouldn't even be talking about these Yes/XTC,King Crimson releases and we would all be the poorer for it as these have been some of the most amazing music releases we have ever received. Think about it for a minute, look at all the other music releases as of late and most of them are in super expensive boxsets that cost you $100 or more to get the type of content we are getting in these reissues at a fraction of the cost and all we get on these releases is a Bluray that is crammed till there is no more space left so that us customers literally get hours and hours of listening pleasure. I have yet to find a reissue program that has given me as much joy as the Yes/King Crimson/Xtc reissue's, they have given me way more pleasure than I could have imagined when I first started my own music listening hobby some 40 years ago.

I think there would have been a way bigger revolt if there had been a month or 2 month delay on this release to correct a few things in the booklet.
I thought this was a music listening hobby that we all share here, I am just floored that people are now complaining about a few things in a booklet when you get so much amazing music on this release.
To me I have never spent more than one or 2 looks through any booklet ever compared to countless hours listening to the music as that is why I buy these releases in the first place, for the MUSIC.

Even if these are not actually just booklet mistakes but actual errors they are "covering up," the point remains valid. And not only should we be grateful for all the great releases we've had from Panegyric, it's my belief that they helped keep surround music alive at a time the industry had turned their back on it (thanks to the way they fouled up the launch) and if not for their courage to delve into a field deemed unprofitable, we wouldn't have a lot of the other surround releases that have appeared since, nor would we be experiencing the current surround renaissance we are now so happily enjoying.

Thanks!

The post you quote is I believe from peterzach, who is a frequent QQ poster too. It shows what a reasonable and intelligent lot that we are over on this forum!! His is a brilliant post, and it is so true, as is your post

 

[ProgRules]

Agreed.
I think the explanation is totally logical & believeable.
The faux outrage machine on SHF is typical.
I'm guessing QQ member ProgRules is the person on SHF futilely making the case for reason in the reaction to the TFTO news.
I appreciate your POV.
I've tried in the past to make the same case for certain releases but gave that up a loooong time ago.

Also the guy that said he got banned from QQ for merely saying that Red was "slightly compressed" is to put it accurately, lying.

Thanks. Yep, that's me. And what a sad state of affairs if someone as looney as me is the voice of reason! @:

And I knew there was a lot more to that story about that poster getting banned. But I didn't want to come right out and call him a liar. I tried to get him to tell me which mod banned him so I could get the real scoop, but now that I think about it, "why should I care?" (Who reference) I know what a superior bunch we have here and that this is the best music site on all the interweb. But I appreciate your confirmation that my intuition was correct.

Thanks!

The post you quote is I believe from peterzach, who is a frequent QQ poster too. It shows what a reasonable and intelligent lot that we are over on this forum!! His is a brilliant post, and it is so true, as is your post

Thanks! It is from Peter, I forgot that I've seen him here as well. I should have included his name in my post- thanks for adding that important detail I overlooked. He def deserves credit for his excellent post.

As far as brilliant and reasonable, I tend to think of us old, surround loving guys as pretty kooky types, at least when I take the perspective of the world-at-large. But the really ugly side of our often obsessive behavior plays out over there, so we are by comparison brilliant and reasonable (not that there aren't some brilliant and reasonable people there, apart from us "dual citizens"). But in my book, here at QQ we are the lovable loonies.

So, while we're giving shout-outs for keeping the surround flame burning, I'd like to take this opportunity to once again thank Jon for his tireless devotion and generous offering of this wonderful site. I believe the high quality of people found here is a direct reflection of his class and character. And his contribution w/ QQ is just as responsible for keeping the surround flame burning and engendering our current renaissance as Steven Wilson and Panegyric.

Cheers to Jon, Steven and everyone at Panegyric! :brew

 

[LuvMyQuad]

For what its worth, I ordered this title from Import CD about a week ago. It had a release date of Oct 7. Mine has not yet shipped. There is a notice on the listing saying it was backordered. Has anyone received a TFTO Bluray from Import CD?