Need advice: best Surround receiver for <500$ (CAN)?

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The Bright Side

The Bright Side

1K Club - QQ Shooting Star
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Hello guys!

I hope you can give me some advice here. My Samsung HW-C560S receiver is starting to give me trouble. Starting yesterday, it no longer properly recognizes 5.1 formats (Dolby 5.1 Surround and DTS) when going through optical cable. It just plays back the source as stereo, applying ProLogic to it. Through HDMI, I still get Surround (SACD, DVD-A, DTS, DD 5.1), but it no longer properly recognizes the formats: when I play DTS, the DTS icon no longer lights up, and DD 5.1 is not recognized as such either. In addition, it has started truncating the beginnings of songs (so e.g. the first half of the first note is cut off/quickly fades in).

I would guess it's broken/breaking, but perhaps anybody has had similar experiences? Any ideas?

My actual question, though, is: I'd like to use this opportunity to get a new receiver. My budget is about 500 Canadian Dollars, and if possible, I am looking for the following:

  • 120&240V AC so I can take it back to Germany with me in the future (not a deal-braker if not supported)
  • Very fast, ideally imperceptible, HDMI handshake (the Samsung is ATROCIOUS, it drops sync 4 times when starting to play surround music, takes 20 full seconds)
  • Analogue 5.1 connectors not necessary (I'll gladly go through HDMI 1.4 if it saves me a couple dollars)
  • Good playback of stereo sources, even on small speakers (I only have those small plastic boxes so far, and stereo sources sound tinny. Most bass actually goes to the center even with amplified sub and 200Hz crossover. My previous 50$ PC-tackon 5.1 system sounded full, strong and punchy in comparison!)
  • DSD/Advanced Res compatibility not necessary for now (the Samsung only "speaks" PCM and SACD/DVD-A sounds great already)

From what I hear, Onkyo has an amazing reputation among audio enthusiasts, but is probably beyond what I can afford. But hey, who knows. Hope you guys have some advice for me! Thanks so much in advance.

EDIT: if it's of any relevance: my playback device is the Oppo 83.
 
Maybe it has nothing to do , but ; have you tried checking your Oppo settings?

My Oppo DV-980H reset itself a couple of nights ago(it had never done that before in the 3 years that I've had it), and I thought it was the receiver, until I went thru the "entire system double check" and found out it was the Oppo.

Good luck!
 
Hey Kap'n Krunch! I didn't go through the Oppo's settings, but I did connect my old Yamaha DVD player that I used for SACD, DVD-A and DTS CD before I got the Oppo. Same result on my receiver. I will toy around with the Oppo some more to be sure, and I guess I should also try playing back a DTS disc from my PC to see what happens then (it goes into the receiver through optical, too).

Mandranke, thanks for the suggestion. Are you using a Pioneer yourself? How's the handshake? How does it perform with regular CDs or MP3s?
 
I have a slightly higher model, the VSX-1120-K, and it is flawless with my sources: Oppo BDP-93, TiVo and XBox connect via HDMI. Wii connects via component. SqueezeBox Touch connects via digital coax (audio only). Oppo plays CD, DVD-A, SACD, BR-A and the Pioneer decodes them all (DTS, AC3, DSD, PCM). Never had a problem with handshake.

Not sure how you want to play MP3s? There are many options, but you could put them on a USB and plug it into the receiver to play. There is also an "iPod interface" I think, but I don't do iPod.
 
Thanks man! The MP3s would just come from my PC over analogue or optical cable (I kinda stopped using optical for 2-channel sources though because for some digital reason, the beginning of sounds after silence is cut off).

Either way, that's great to know! Thanks!

I also saw a "high speed HDMI cable" while I was browsing around online shops this morning. Is there a speed difference between HDMI cables, and will a "better" one get me better handshake times or eliminate other issues? I used to think there was no such difference.
 
The Bright Side said:
Thanks man! The MP3s would just come from my PC over analogue or optical cable (I kinda stopped using optical for 2-channel sources though because for some digital reason, the beginning of sounds after silence is cut off).

Either way, that's great to know! Thanks!

I also saw a "high speed HDMI cable" while I was browsing around online shops this morning. Is there a speed difference between HDMI cables, and will a "better" one get me better handshake times or eliminate other issues? I used to think there was no such difference.
Click to expand...

HDMI cable is HDMI cable - buy the thinnest/shortest you can get by with (the HDMI connector on thick cables tends to bend and break the input jack due to the cable weight) - Since HDMI is all digital, bits is bits. It won't improve handshake times or anything unless the cable is broken - then there are major glitches and not subtle degradation's. You can buy a 3 to 6 foot HDMI cable at Best Buy for around 10 bucks - buy the cheapest one - again, cable is cable with HDMI (except for very long runs).
 
Nice! Thanks. That's exactly what I thought.

EDIT: the Pioneer receivers do look good. I actually found the VSX-821-K for 350 CAN$ (200 in the US, go figure) which, in direct comparison to the 1020, seems to only miss features I don't care about. Like Internet radio, iPhone functionality, Win7 compatibility... and capability for 2 less speakers (5.1 instead of 7.1). I may just go for that.

I'd love if you guys had more suggestions or could relay your experiences with Pioneer with regards to my questions in the first post.

Thanks for your help so far, I love this community :)
 
My Kenwood Sovereign 5090 THX receiver stopped recognizing AC-3 and DTS signals - it would turn on DTS for AC-3 and MPEG for DTS, so no sound. The analog and 5.1 inputs still worked, so I used it as a surround ex decoder, but then the amps died too - I LOVED that receiver - Kenwood did a great job on their Sovereign designs, but the build quality sucked - and I guess THX doesn't test for longevity.

My new receiver is a Denon 3808 that I was given when my partners dad traded up (he used my broken receiver as an excuse to buy a new Denon and give me the "old" one) - they are very cheap now and are EXCELLENT with fast HDMI handshake times, plus have Audyssey Multi EQ built in - since they are a few years old you can get new ones at great prices - they decode all the advanced formats including 7.1 plus have 7.1 analog inputs. The only thing they don't do is 3D. They use the Faroudja IC for de-interlacing and up-scaling standard def signals - it makes LaserDisc look great on my LCD TV. Denon's are not too expensive for what you get - I used to love my two Pioneer receivers that I used with outboard AC-3 and DTS decoders, the Pioneer VSX-9300 (first receiver with Sanyo's Pro-Logic IC and outboard VCA's for better performance) and the VSX-D1S (all digital Pro-Logic decoding) - but I have them packed away now since they still work perfectly.

So I know you were asking about Pioneer, but check out Denon - they and Marantz are the same company now.
 
If you have both optical coax and toslink you might try switching them around.
My older Sony AVR's toslink inputs are getting flaky with the 50 foot toslink cable running from my pc to the AVR, and the single coax input died altogether.
 
I only have two TOSLINK cables, but I did notice that when using the optical connection from my PC to the receiver, all formats are recognized properly. So perhaps the optical cable between Oppo and receiver has a problem. I will check this out when I find some more time (crazy week)...
 
A source you might consider for a budget AVR is Newegg. If you subscribe to the daily eblast emails you can get a heads up on what's on or about to be on sale.
This is what I did when I was sourcing components to build my pc, and being able to move quickly can save some $$.
You may/may not find something you can be happy with over a given period of time but as long as you're still looking it can't hurt.
 
Denon would be my first choice. I sold Quad in the '70's and modern gear from '99-'03. I have a Denon AVR-3801 Circa 2000 for my second system. It rocks. Onkyo TX-SR504 drives my third system. I've sold Pioneer and Yamaha, they're very good, although the Yamaha may be a tad bright in the high end. Yes, Denon and Marantz are owned by the same people, so they're basically the same.

I recommend you audition and operate them. You'll get a better idea of what's right for you. Good luck in your search.
Linda
 
Quad Linda said:
Denon would be my first choice. I sold Quad in the '70's and modern gear from '99-'03. I have a Denon AVR-3801 Circa 2000 for my second system. It rocks. Onkyo TX-SR504 drives my third system. I've sold Pioneer and Yamaha, they're very good, although the Yamaha may be a tad bright in the high end. Yes, Denon and Marantz are owned by the same people, so they're basically the same.

I recommend you audition and operate them. You'll get a better idea of what's right for you. Good luck in your search.
Linda
Click to expand...
It's always good if you can actually check out the physical equipment, but not possible for many of us without traveling long distances.
I would say check the specs, as many reviews as you can find, and more importantly check that the device has all the inputs/outputs and power you need - although I tend to not put too
much faith in advertised power specs. Keep an eye toward tech you may not have thought of - such as DNLA.
 
Having sold hi-fi for many years, I place little creedence in specs. There are lies, damn lies and specs/statistics.

Does that $50 car audio power amp really have as many watts as my $1500 B&K power amp?? I must have been gypped. lol!!

Linda
Caveat Emptor

boondocks said:
It's always good if you can actually check out the physical equipment, but not possible for many of us without traveling long distances.
I would say check the specs, as many reviews as you can find, and more importantly check that the device has all the inputs/outputs and power you need - although I tend to not put too
much faith in advertised power specs. Keep an eye toward tech you may not have thought of - such as DNLA.
Click to expand...
 
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