Beatles 1+ Blu-Ray / DVD 5.1-channel surround audio on Nov 6, 2015

QuadraphonicQuad

Help Support QuadraphonicQuad:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.
Unfortunately the majority rules...and needless to say we(surround community)aren't that group...kinda sucks...but that's our position in the pecking order....I'm just happy to get the surround releases that we are getting..


I think we're being spoiled by so many of the great things we are getting, and it's making many of us a whole lot less tolerant when something half-assed like this happens. When it comes to the Beatles, I just want to see roughly the second half of their albums done properly like Steven or Jakko would handle them. I had a feeling this was a set-up for disappointment, but actually I don't have much of a problem with the result we got. My expectations weren't high to begin with.
 
http://www.ew.com/article/2015/11/11/giles-martin-beatles-remasters
Posted November 11 2015 — 5:04 PM EST

The Beatles released 1+ last week, a new collection that, most notably, includes dozens of rare music videos the band recorded over the years. But tucked away behind the two Blu-ray discs is a revamped version of 1, the 2000 compilation that features all 27 of the Fab Four’s No. 1 hits. Don’t ignore that disc. When the team behind 1+ decided to polish up the video clips, it decided to also remix the songs on 1 — and tapped Giles Martin, the son of esteemed Beatles producer George Martin, to head up the job.

“They still sound like the songs you love,” Martin tells EW. “It’s just that if you go back to the original, you should prefer what we’ve done. When you hear them you feel closer to the band than you ever did before.”

The motivation behind the project is mostly technological. As Martin began to assist with fixing up the audio tracks for the 1+ video clips, he realized that his goal of making them “more immersive” should also apply to 1. While modern remastering efforts — most recently the 2009 reissuing of the band’s entire catalog — cleaned up the audio, none truly optimized the recording for modern, high-definition sound systems.

“You have to understand, the original Beatles mixes were designed for mono playback,” Martin explains. “The stereos that we all know and love were done very, very quickly. The band was never present when the stereos were made.”

Martin’s mission was to pretend the Beatles were in the room with him and tailor 1’s iconic hits for cutting-edge stereos — no easy task when you know the audience for your work will likely examine it with a fine-toothed comb. “My approach was to be respectful of everything,” the producer says. “I had sessions and sessions where I flipped between previously remastered stereos, the mono remasters, and the remixes we’ve done. I flip between everything and make sure I prefer what we’ve done.”

But honoring the past didn’t mean Martin refused to make necessary changes. Consider “Paperback Writer.” The band only recorded one and a half takes of the classic song — “I couldn’t believe it when I looked at the tapes,” Martin says — and the session’s spontaneity comes through on the recording. But Martin also heard a “layer of stuff” that’s not on the raw tapes. The problem mainly stemmed from an ill-conceived stereo mix he says was created just “for the sake of being stereo.” It isolated the band on one side, the bass on the other side, and the vocals in the center, even when the song “sounds better in our world coming out of two speakers.” By returning some of its elements to mono, Martin restored the “visceral feeling” that he thinks the band intended.

The fresh edition of 1 also improves the band’s famed recordings in ways the 2009 reissue project didn’t. “It’s vastly different,” Martin says. “The remasters went back to these final mix tapes and remastered them. They cleaned them up and then they EQ-ed them and released them. What we’re doing is remixing. We’re going not to the final mix, we’re creating our own mixes.”

That explains why Martin performed the same procedure on audio tracks from the Blu-ray discs that don’t appear on 1. He’s most proud of his work on “Strawberry Fields Forever,” which had much of its studio wizardry wiped away on previous stereo mixes. “It has this mellotron pulse that in the mono version goes under the vocal and sounds really cool,” Martin says. “It sounds much more intense to me, it sounds claustrophobic in a strange way. That’s what John would’ve wanted.” The original stereo mix isolated the mellotron pulse to the right-hand side, and couldn’t be repaired by the surface-level edits made in previous remastering projects.

“It has the feel of the mono, but it’s in stereo,” Martin says of the new version. “It sounds stronger, like it has a spine to it. Fans of the Beatles say you have to listen to the monos, but nobody’s going to do that. Only the fans are going to do that. I’m trying to create that attention to detail in a stereo format.”

But despite his studio efforts — which have created noticeable improvements on the originals — Martin understands that to a certain extent the endeavor is just icing on the cake. “The Beatles’ music makes people happy, and there it’s great to make sure it exists in the world. I don’t think these mixes changes that in a big way, but you want to make sure you do the best job you can.”
 
leahypc;270126[B said:
]I think we're being spoiled by so many of the great things [/B]we are getting, and it's making many of us a whole lot less tolerant when something half-assed like this happens. When it comes to the Beatles, I just want to see roughly the second half of their albums done properly like Steven or Jakko would handle them. I had a feeling this was a set-up for disappointment, but actually I don't have much of a problem with the result we got. My expectations weren't high to begin with.

You are right that we are getting spoiled...between the Steven Wilson mixes and the excellent AF quad series we are getting some superb titles...to be candid this Beatles surround mix isn't an anomaly...there are tons of blu ray concerts that don't have discrete sounding mixes...it's not that it's a rare event....and they advertise surround as part of their marketing....really no different than the Beatles1 did...but the expectations were so much more because of the content involved and the recent string of superb sounding surround discs... after the initial knee jerk reaction by some at least now the title is being discussed in a logical manner...the title has value...just not as a surround title...
 
Final Disc 1 LFE mega-bass scoreboard. Reduce the LFE by the amount shown to even-out the bass level with the other songs on Disc 1.

Ticket To Ride = -15dB
We Can Work It Out = -9dB
Paperback Writer = -6dB
Penny Lane = -6dB
All You Need Is Love = -4.5dB
Let It Be = -6dB

Notes:
1) If you don't see the song listed, then it is within 3dB of the correct LFE level (IMHO).
2) Ticket To Ride far exceeds the correct LFE level and could actually damage some subwoofers if played at a high volume. The others level are, at least, tolerable.
3) I am working on Disc 2 and will provide a Disc 2 only update soon.

Andy
 
Having just watched all of disc 2, I have to throw in a comment about Twist and Shout. Now I know that the song's multitrack master is only a twin-track recording with vocals on one track and instruments on the other with plenty of bleed-through between the tracks since they were recorded live. But, the Beatles 1+ 5.1-channel mix must be the worst mix of that song in history.

The instruments and reduced-level vocals are in the left and left rear channel only. The center channel is reduced vocals. The right channel is reduced-level vocals along with ambient reflections and the right rear channel is delayed ambient reflections.

The effect of all this is all of the instruments are on the left and left rear and the vocals are in the center. On the right there is, well, nothing but reflections that get buried by everything else.

There were so many better ways to handle this. The 5.1-channel Anthology mix of Twist and Shout was wonderful in the way it felt like the instruments had been expanded around the room but kept the vocals centered. I could also point out the advances made since 2000 in music separations (forensic audio), but that is another topic.

There are a lot of the Beatles 1+ mixes (once I accepted the reasons for the reduced-surround) that I like but this and the LFE issues have just left me shaking my head. Didn't anyone listen to the DTS-HD 5.1-channel track before shipping the discs? Surely, an everything on the left side of the room mix was not what people really intended, right?

Andy
 
Just to show you how opinions differ...I'm hearing lots of glowing reports of this set "outside" the surround community...which really doesn't surprise me...I thought I'd share a post with you from "2 channel land"...scroll down to post 10714...the post begins with "whew, caught up with this thread" HERE
 
Just to show you how opinions differ...I'm hearing lots of glowing reports of this set "outside" the surround community...which really doesn't surprise me...I thought I'd share a post with you from "2 channel land"...scroll down to post 10714...the post begins with "whew, caught up with this thread" HERE

Sometimes there is way too much analysis which takes away from the enjoyment of something new..
 
Reading the reviews of these "surround mixes" is like watching an episode of the Benny Hill show...

Critic: "...and it's just brilliant the way you switched to black and white until the end of the film at that scene! It symbolizes perfectly the..."

Producer: "Actually we ran out of color film and couldn't afford any more."
 
I watched the '1' Blu-Ray today, so the disappointment was that it wasn't a 5.1 BD-A, but as a BD-V I enjoyed it. So it should be seen as a video release not an audio one. The 5.1 'mixes' aren't really, one or two you suddenly think oh an instrument over there, but having said that the clarity is good, it has been compressed to give it 'punch', but it doesn't sound bad, it is loud compared to most BD-A.

I grew up with The Beatles firstly on the radio then TV, and my father playing their songs to us on the piano. I remember being woken up by my parents to watch the transatlantic broadcast, of going to see Yellow Submarine along with my younger brother when it came out, and of coming home from school and seeing them on the TV news (Black & White, 405 lines!) playing on the top of the Apple building in London. So the music means a lot to me, plus the nostalgia of watching the 'videos'.

It cost me £40 (approx. $61), for 2 BDs and a CD with informative text on each song in the book, but compare that to what you get with the Jethro Tull releases, and it does seem a bit expensive. Am I glad I got it, yes.
 
Target stores have the 2-disk set CD+DVD for $9.99 right now, if you figure the $10 gift card into it. You have to pay $19.99 and use the gift card they give you for your next purchase. Needless to say I picked one up. It's a whopping $24.99 on Amazon.
 

Attachments

  • beatles1_plus_DVD.jpg
    beatles1_plus_DVD.jpg
    26.4 KB · Views: 317
  • beatles1_plus_DVD_open.jpg
    beatles1_plus_DVD_open.jpg
    48.5 KB · Views: 306
Last edited:
Having been burned in the past, I was cautious about this, but I'm 99% sure that some of the mixes are 'proper' surround seeing as I asked the guy who wrote the sleevenotes and he said, “I heard a few at Abbey Road, properly fantastic, instruments all around you.”

Can’t expect much from the early, live or TV versions, but there are a lot of later studio tracks...

Totally agree the ‘based on mono mixes’ can be interpreted in multiple ways. It’s definitely the right thing to do, seeing as the mono mixes are the authorised mixes, but yes, we want them expanded to 5.1 !

This was the post that raised my expectations that we were going to get an aggressive surround mix. I wonder what the "guy who wrote the sleeve notes" actually heard.
 
Target stores have the 2-disk set CD+DVD for $9.99 right now, if you figure the $10 gift card into it. You have to pay $19.99 and use the gift card they give you for your next purchase. Needless to say I picked one up. It's a whopping $24.99 on Amazon.

Hell, you can't go wrong with that price.
 
I don't hear it on Free as a Bird, but I was too quick with Real Love. It's a drastically different mix. In a way that makes it sound like a different take. And not great surround... So, $40 for one song :) I'll take it.

A few things I notice about the stereo remix of "Free As A Bird". One is that the original mix is noticeably brighter. Two - during the intro, the original mix has a fairly audible hi hat keeping the eight note beat. In the new mix, I can't hear the hi hat at all, but the previously nearly inaudible tambourine in the right channel is now fairly loud. Three - in the original mix, George sings "..the life that we once knew." In the new mix, he sings "...the *love* that we once knew." Four - John's voice sounds less "Cassette-y" to my ear. Five - the backwards voice at the end is now forwards.

J. D.
 
The DVD LPCM audio is 16/48... a bit of a surprise. An hour of 24/96 LPCM audio won't fit on a DVD?
 
This was the post that raised my expectations that we were going to get an aggressive surround mix. I wonder what the "guy who wrote the sleeve notes" actually heard.

I know - it certainly raised my expectations. Mark Ellen has been a respected music journalist for decades - Q Magazine, Word Magazine, OGWT, Live Aid. I still respect his opinion, but think that maybe he got to listen to the few that do have surround and also, perhaps, swept along with the excitement of being at Abbey Road for the playback.

I specifically asked, "Are they 'proper' surround (like quad) or just 'enhanced stereo' (as per movie mixes)?" so I thought I'd got the definitive answer. Shows how little surround is understood by the industry, apart from a few pioneers. :(
 
The DVD LPCM audio is 16/48... a bit of a surprise. An hour of 24/96 LPCM audio won't fit on a DVD?

The first BD is 35 GB. A DL DVD has a capacity of 8.5 GB. I know it is kind of an apples to oranges comparison but you can see that they likely had fun getting even SD video on the DVD along with a lossy surround mix and 16 bit stereo.
 
Back
Top