thank you for the cool info as ever Bill, Happy New Year!
Happy New Year to you fredy and to one and ALL...……….
What's the Latest MATRIX LP/CD Added to Your Pile? SQ, QS, RM, EV
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Happy New Year to you fredy and to one and ALL...……….
great finds!
love these two, too.. and you don't see them come up that often, especially the Survival SQ in good nick seems to come up quite infrequently.. we have no discrete point of reference for the Survival Quad but if we ever do get a DV release i reckon the Surround Master will have been shown to have done a great job, it's fab and easily one of my all-time faves from SQ!
The Survival actually turned up in a local record store ($15), which was very exciting! Most of the stores by me are usually pretty sparse when it comes to quad, and whatever little turns up is usually early CBS gold border titles I've already got (Abraxas, Indian Reservation, etc).
It pans out very nicely through the Tate- the "got to give the people..." backing vocals are loud and clear in the rears on the first track.
I'm still trying to track down Family Reunion- ordered a copy from discogs a few weeks back and I ended up with the stereo LP
. Maybe DV will get to it before I do...I snagged Go For Your Guns online ($25 shipped)- a bit more than I'm usually willing to pay for an SQ disc, but this is a pretty rare later-era CBS title. It's got a slight warp to it, but sounds pretty good. I have to admit I didn't know anything from the Isleys other than "That Lady" before I got into this whole quad thing. This album is fantastic! It's amazing how these guys go from full-on funky to these intense slow jams on a track-by-track basis.
I could write an essay on how good the mix is on this one. Larry Keyes really perfected his craft by 1977. The rears are chock full of accent handclaps, backing vocals, rhythm guitars, and even reverb- which I found unusual, as CBS quads are usually mixed so dry to improve decoding. The Tate handles it pretty well though, and it's really effective on the track "Voyage To Atlantis".
I'm particularly enamored with "Climbin' Up The Latter", which has this really cool front-to-rear time delay effect on the lead vocal that makes it sound huge. It also really brings out this funky rhythm guitar bit in the left rear channel. I A/B'd it to the stereo mix and it's no contest.
These are just too good to stay locked away in the vaults forever...
The Survival actually turned up in a local record store ($15), which was very exciting! Most of the stores by me are usually pretty sparse when it comes to quad, and whatever little turns up is usually early CBS gold border titles I've already got (Abraxas, Indian Reservation, etc).
It pans out very nicely through the Tate- the "got to give the people..." backing vocals are loud and clear in the rears on the first track.
I'm still trying to track down Family Reunion- ordered a copy from discogs a few weeks back and I ended up with the stereo LP
I snagged Go For Your Guns online ($25 shipped)- a bit more than I'm usually willing to pay for an SQ disc, but this is a pretty rare later-era CBS title. It's got a slight warp to it, but sounds pretty good. I have to admit I didn't know anything from the Isleys other than "That Lady" before I got into this whole quad thing. This album is fantastic! It's amazing how these guys go from full-on funky to these intense slow jams on a track-by-track basis.
I could write an essay on how good the mix is on this one. Larry Keyes really perfected his craft by 1977. The rears are chock full of accent handclaps, backing vocals, rhythm guitars, and even reverb- which I found unusual, as CBS quads are usually mixed so dry to improve decoding. The Tate handles it pretty well though, and it's really effective on the track "Voyage To Atlantis".
I'm particularly enamored with "Climbin' Up The Latter", which has this really cool front-to-rear time delay effect on the lead vocal that makes it sound huge. It also really brings out this funky rhythm guitar bit in the left rear channel. I A/B'd it to the stereo mix and it's no contest.
These are just too good to stay locked away in the vaults forever...
nice one! we mostly get Classical Quad LPs in my local record shops, i'd pass out if I saw the O'Jays! Survival is a more adventurous Quad than Family Reunion, right from the very start there's a quick little round the room pan on the repeated hi-hat mini intro on Got To Give The People, cool way to start a Quad album! Family Reunion's a more subtle Quad, though the highlights are arguably stronger material and the mixes are slick without being showy.. Livin' For The Weekend has vocal refrains niftily popping up in various speakers while they're making their call to arms to hit the disco! "lets go downtown..".. in an album of slower numbers (title track, She's Only A Woman, You and Me, Stairway To Heaven) the uptempo numbers really stand out and Weekend is an exciting vamp made even more lively in Quad.. I Love Music has all the bongo tastic and backing vocal rear action you could want, its great to hear a bona fide disco classic getting great Quad treatment.. neither Survival nor Family Reunion are as flashy as the Ship Ahoy Quad but they're still great.. though my favourite O'Jays Quad is their last, Message In The Music, it's a really smooth sophisticated mix, more modern in feel, it could be a latterday surround recording, it's truly an exceptional Quad.
you're right GFYG does use a lot of reverb, some very cool effects on the tracks you mention. I think Larry Keyes had perfected how to do reverb and front to back delay within SQ's limitations with stuff like the Johnnie Taylor Eargasm Quad (Somebody's Gettin It) but GFYG takes it to another level and what's surprising is, since hearing the discrete presentation, how well the Surround Master shifts things pretty much where they should be while coping with the reverb!
i'm curious, does GFYG have distortion on the lead vocals on Footsteps In The Dark when decoded thru your Tate as it does decoded thru the SM?
also, do you have the other Isley Quads already?
before getting the Surround Master and getting into SQ etc., both Live It Up and Harvest For The World were portrayed as underwhelming by reputation and it had been suggested maybe even fake but I don't think they are at all, Live It Up in particular has definite mix differences with different vocal takes and vocals left in that are punched out in the Stereo, very cool and several tracks on Harvest FTW have various vocals panned about the surround soundfield to nice effect, in the same way the later O'Jays albums are more subtle Quad than Ship Ahoy the later Isley Quads are more subtle than 3+3 but they are all delightful imho.. maybe one day DV will do these funky gems justice..
"..might as well face the facts,
no need to be holding back,
need a little taste of Quad..!!"
nice one! we mostly get Classical Quad LPs in my local record shops, i'd pass out if I saw the O'Jays! Survival is a more adventurous Quad than Family Reunion, right from the very start there's a quick little round the room pan on the repeated hi-hat mini intro on Got To Give The People, cool way to start a Quad album! Family Reunion's a more subtle Quad, though the highlights are arguably stronger material and the mixes are slick without being showy.. Livin' For The Weekend has vocal refrains niftily popping up in various speakers while they're making their call to arms to hit the disco! "lets go downtown..".. in an album of slower numbers (title track, She's Only A Woman, You and Me, Stairway To Heaven) the uptempo numbers really stand out and Weekend is an exciting vamp made even more lively in Quad.. I Love Music has all the bongo tastic and backing vocal rear action you could want, its great to hear a bona fide disco classic getting great Quad treatment.. neither Survival nor Family Reunion are as flashy as the Ship Ahoy Quad but they're still great.. though my favourite O'Jays Quad is their last, Message In The Music, it's a really smooth sophisticated mix, more modern in feel, it could be a latterday surround recording, it's truly an exceptional Quad.
you're right GFYG does use a lot of reverb, some very cool effects on the tracks you mention. I think Larry Keyes had perfected how to do reverb and front to back delay within SQ's limitations with stuff like the Johnnie Taylor Eargasm Quad (Somebody's Gettin It) but GFYG takes it to another level and what's surprising is, since hearing the discrete presentation, how well the Surround Master shifts things pretty much where they should be while coping with the reverb!
i'm curious, does GFYG have distortion on the lead vocals on Footsteps In The Dark when decoded thru your Tate as it does decoded thru the SM?
also, do you have the other Isley Quads already?
before getting the Surround Master and getting into SQ etc., both Live It Up and Harvest For The World were portrayed as underwhelming by reputation and it had been suggested maybe even fake but I don't think they are at all, Live It Up in particular has definite mix differences with different vocal takes and vocals left in that are punched out in the Stereo, very cool and several tracks on Harvest FTW have various vocals panned about the surround soundfield to nice effect, in the same way the later O'Jays albums are more subtle Quad than Ship Ahoy the later Isley Quads are more subtle than 3+3 but they are all delightful imho.. maybe one day DV will do these funky gems justice..
"..might as well face the facts,
no need to be holding back,
need a little taste of Quad..!!"
Ahhh-hhhmm,
Excusez-moi monsieur piège en acier: "i imagine its youth on sjc's side helps keep those facts and figures at his fingertips! oh to be young, hung and full of cumulative knowledge!"
.Wadda ya mean?, wadda ya mean?
Hey, I'm just a Bud in the can kind of guy, OK maybe an occasional Stella;
wait, what? They bought Bud- it all gets so confusing!That'll be three Buds please
Soundfield
1K Club - QQ Shooting Star
There were a few quad era recordings of the Bruckner symphonies by the major labels that were widely available and so are still easy to find today (particularly the EMI Karajan 4 and EMI Giulini 2 & 9). Unfortunately there seems to have been no complete cycle, and trying to find any other interesting performances has been something of a struggle, but I’m starting the New Year well, just having taken delivery of these rarities:
Kurt Masur’s Symphony No. 9 -
And also on Eurodisc, obviously as part of the series (did they intend a complete cycle I wonder?) Masur’s performances of Symphonies 6 & 8. I’ve never seen this box set offered for sale before and this one is still sealed (it cost me a fortune from a US dealer though!) –
Even more obscure (and almost as expensive!) is this mint condition QS box set of two LPs of a recording by Moshe Atzmon on the Swiss Ex Libris label of Symphony No.7 -
An unusual 360 deg. arrangement of the orchestra around the conductor is shown in the recording session photos in the booklet - it will be interesting to hear how that is reflected on playback-
Kurt Masur’s Symphony No. 9 -
And also on Eurodisc, obviously as part of the series (did they intend a complete cycle I wonder?) Masur’s performances of Symphonies 6 & 8. I’ve never seen this box set offered for sale before and this one is still sealed (it cost me a fortune from a US dealer though!) –
Even more obscure (and almost as expensive!) is this mint condition QS box set of two LPs of a recording by Moshe Atzmon on the Swiss Ex Libris label of Symphony No.7 -
An unusual 360 deg. arrangement of the orchestra around the conductor is shown in the recording session photos in the booklet - it will be interesting to hear how that is reflected on playback-
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Awesome mixes! The Wild Cherry is your typical later-era CBS mix with drums, bass, guitar solos and vocals upfront, with rhythm guitars and horns in the rears. Unfortunately it's not the one with "Play That Funky Music", but it's got some good tunes. However, there's something off about the fidelity of the pressing- it's really really bright and the vocals occasionally distort.
The Rufus is one of the most discrete QS LP's I've heard- right from the get-go the opening guitar in "You Got The Love" is in the right rear speaker. "Tell Me Something Good" has the talk-box in right rear and the heavy breathing before the chorus moves around the room. Love it!
Soundfield
1K Club - QQ Shooting Star
A little bit more digging allows me to answer my own question - turns out there was indeed a complete Masur SQ cycle on Eurodisc, and apparently some of the recordings also appeared on the Vanguard label. Unfortunately the availability of most of them makes hen's teeth seem common.
Not sure if the complete cycle is available in another format, but Eurodisc was one of the few labels to issue SQ quad recordings on cd .
happy hunting .
Went record store hunting today, came out with these. Recording in Desire right now...
oohhh i loooove playin' that funky Wild Cherry Quad music! i too wrestled with distortion on the SQ LP (particularly sibilant lead vocals; "yeah we played that funky music and we were looking SSSH-OH good, yeah"... "you can go thru your life SHHH-OH mistaken.." but weirdly only on Side 1.. something must've happened/changed with the mastering and/or encoding on the later CBS SQ records because there's distortion on a number of their Quad discs from 76-77 when decoded (incl. Burton Cummings, Conquistador, Electrified Funk, Go For Your Guns)... but decoding quibbles aside the mix is great, the result of an unusual/interesting Quad mix pairing of Don Puluse (who also engineered the album in Stereo, as well as the excellent Labelle Quad mixes) and CBS Quad stalwart Larry Keyes.
do you have the Rufusized QS LP also? it's the best sounding and decoding QS record i have, just stunning.
nice finds! Johnnie T.'s Rated Ex SQ is pretty scarce.. was never impressed with that West, Bruce & Laing SQ, sludgey grungy dark sounding record.. and are those sides of the Desire SQ ever packed to the label with grooves, wowzers! its not Don Young's finest Quad mixing moment, some things feel out of whack front to back but still better balanced than his Turnstiles i thought.
Are you running that through a Tate?
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ALL the more reason for Dutton Vocalion to release those titles in pristine sounding, properly decoded QUAD SACDs..........Wonder what sjcorne [Jonathan] paid for the QUAD LP of Neilsen's Second Symphony [I just bought all Nielsen's symphonies on BD~A 5.0 which included 5 SACDs from LSO direct for under £18.]
You're absolutely right about the fidelity on the West, Bruce & Laing title- right from the opening guitar notes I noticed it's quite dull, sounding almost Q8-like. The mix is a super discrete Kleiner/Young job though. We'll see if some EQ can improve things.
Obviously we have Johnnie's two quads on SACD, but the SQ is a fun little collectible that didn't run me much ($12). I find it's fun to keep the SQ discs around even if you have a discrete reference just to see how they pan out. Sometimes they match pretty close- this one happens to be very good, backing vocals and thunderstorm effects locked in the rears on "Stormy" for instance, vocals are wiped out of the rears, etc. Yet others seem to barely resemble the discrete mix- For example I did Johnny Winter's Still Alive & Well last night and it's nothing like the Q8 conversion I have, even through the Tate. Very odd mix for CBS with the lead guitar sometimes in all four speakers or in one side-wall.
Desire really does push the limits of vinyl, on side 2 especially. I like what I'm hearing with the mix so far- the first track has the violin hard in the right rear, some bongo action in the left rear, and isolated harmonies in each. Definitely more to come...
BTW I don't have yet have the Rufusized LP yet, can't wait to pick it up now.
$2 (!). And I'd certainly hope DV aren't "decoding" their SACDs, aside from that Airto/Deodato title
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I think that the Desire album would be the better of the four , both SQ mix and music.
Unfortunately we won't be seeing that in SACD fr DV anytime soon ...........probably , and likely Sony would want them to pay in..... live human organs.
Well it is Dylan .
Nice catch btw.
Thanks! The store I found it in actually had a separate bin for quad records, which you really don't seen nowadays. Unfortunately it's a pretty noisy pressing, even after various cleanings- I'm on my third transfer attempt now.
It's a shame because it's decoding really well and the mix is great! The rears usually have the violin and Emmylou Harris' backing vocals. Shame there was no Q8, It'd be fun to shut the fronts off and hear those parts isolated.
Speaking of which, I wonder why this one never made it to Q8? The few common threads between most of those SQ-only titles is that they were on sub-labels distributed through CBS (Janis Ian on Rainbow, B.T. Express on Roadshow, Billy Joel on Family Productions, etc) OR that they were double LPs which would necessitate a more costly two-tape set (Miles Davis, Don Ellis). This title doesn't fit either of those, but neither did Johnnie Taylor's Eargasm, Phoebe Snow's Second Childhood, or Dave Mason's Split Coconut. We'll probably never get the answer...
funny, i was giving the Second Childhood SQ a spin last night for the first time in a long time and it struck me how lovely the reverbed vocal effect is in the Rears (one Rear after the other) in the chorus of Two Fisted Love.. wonder who mixed it.. we'll probably never get an answer on that either!
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