Yes Relayer coming in 5.1 by Steven Wilson

[ssully]

Well, "atrocious" is just a nice sounding word I've been wanting to use some time now, and if it sounds off to you, you might replace it with "shrill and distorted and impossible to crank up".

Since that one sounds pretty much like the LP, and I've been cranking all those versions up for years, I can't agree.

Certainly it's an album that was recorded 'hot' (in analog), but to me an 'atrocious' recording would be, say, something like Velvet Underground 'White Light/White Heat' (which is still a great record). Or maybe the first "Aqualung' CD, which had all sorts of FUBAR mastering issues going on.

I didn't like the 2004 Relayer remaster , since they seem to have lopped off a bunch of treble. But the first CD (Zal Schreiber mastering) and Marinos's 1994 , aren't bad (not even all that different, really), and the HDCD, when decoded, is also fun. Since Steve Wilson likes to give us 'straight up' transfers of the master tapes, it'll be interesting to see how those sound in comparison to what we've had so far.

 

[bangdrum6]

... and a very interesting point about Andersons voice being pushed up a bit on CTTE. I was very worried about that before the release. I remember years ago an interview in which Anderson said he purposely liked his vocals buried within the mix (not too loud) which is excellent. I cant really say how the Wilson stereo mix handles that since I cant get away from the 5.1 mix. I love the surround mix very much although I do think there are some clarity issues generally with the instruments here or there with this or that due to the original recordings volumes being too hot that Wilson may not have been able to correct. Obviously when walking around the room the loudness of the vocals changes and I love this experience, but I find myself standing in front of the center speaker often because Andersons voice is so profound I cant pull myself away. Hearing his voice coming out of the center speaker blows me away. Now I'm curious, I will have to listen to the stereo mix some more.

 

[drphibes]

I described them in the CttE thread, where they belong.

Well, this qualifies as one of the least helpful posts of the year, given that there are two CttE threads, one announcing and discussing the release, and a second thread that is the poll thread.

But not to worry, Plan9! I am here to help. ssully has some thoughtful comments on the album here:

https://www.quadraphonicquad.com/fo...-AUDIO-BLU-RAY&p=197387&viewfull=1#post197387

https://www.quadraphonicquad.com/fo...-AUDIO-BLU-RAY&p=199977&viewfull=1#post199977

https://www.quadraphonicquad.com/fo...-AUDIO-BLU-RAY&p=200337&viewfull=1#post200337

https://www.quadraphonicquad.com/fo...5-1-in-October&p=201690&viewfull=1#post201690

 

[user 1679]

@doppelbock: Are you by any chance a musician? I was wondering if that would impact your interest in Relayer or not...

I'd say "yes" but my musician skills are somewhat up for debate - a dabbler in various instruments, a little familiar with many, proficient at few.

I loved The Nice, I liked those 71/72 Yes albums, I liked Refugee too...thought Relayer would be the best thing ever, but as I said, the mix of Moraz and Yes didn't work as they hoped, quite obvious from his short stay in the band.

 

[DennisMoore Jr.]

I'd say "yes" but my musician skills are somewhat up for debate - a dabbler in various instruments, a little familiar with many, proficient at few.

I loved The Nice, I liked those 71/72 Yes albums, I liked Refugee too...thought Relayer would be the best thing ever, but as I said, the mix of Moraz and Yes didn't work as they hoped, quite obvious from his short stay in the band.

Thanks for the reply! Fair enough. To each his own & I certainly respect your position on Relayer. I always loved Moraz' work on Relayer, though but me as a skinny white guy from the burbs, it wasn't genetically in me to relate to PM"s latin heritage(as to how it influences his playing, as Moraz has stated on many occasions). Cha cha cha! Indeed! But I love Relayer, no excuses at all(cept for the horrible sound). I never much cared for PM's interpretations of the classic YES stuff he had to play. He never stuck to the original Wakemen lines and his keyboards were very different. Moraz sure loved the Fender Rhodes...

But as a guitarist, Steve Howe amazed even more with his work on Relayer. Perhaps his best guitar work with YES wihich says a lot, for sure.

But as far as Patrick Moraz' contribution in YES I thought they were substantial & amazing, considering he also did most of Going For The One. Yep, that album was done mostly before Wakey-Mon rejoined.

And I gotta admit Moraz was absolutely BRILLIANT on Squire's Fish Out Of Water LP.

For the Holy Trinity of prog: YES - ELP - Genesis; there is not a single album I don't really enjoy(up until 1980). Those three bands really evolved into a different band with each new album. Amazing really.
But I respect the fact that Relayer didn't do it for you. Perhaps the upcoming 5.1 remix will present it in a different light for you. :sun

 

[Jeffrey Michael]

"Relayer" is one of my favorites of early Yes. Patrick Moraz is a pretty darn good keyboard player. And don't forget the four LP's he did with The Moody Blues that includes "Long Distance Voyager" that went to numero uno.

 

[timbre4]

I did manage to see Yes with Patrick Moraz twice; the first time was on his birthday in 1975 and an outdoor multi-band extravaganza in 1976. Dazzled me both times. My theory as to Howe's amazing guitar work on Relayer was that it was being written before Moraz joined and they were flirting with the idea that guitar synths (in their infancy at best) could carry the ball entirely. Then after Patrick signed on, it was a matter what to keep in the arrangements and what Patrick's keyboards should instead voice.

 

[ssully]

Yes were enamoured with jazz fusion at the time Relayer was being composed -- they considered bands like Mahavishnu Orchestra and RTF to be their competition.

Bringing on board a keyboard player who had prog, classical, and jazz chops to spare (quite a bit more so than Wakeman), *and* facility with the pitch bend wheel, was wholly consistent with the musical times. I would love to have heard what he would have done with the 'Going for the One' tracks.

 

[DennisMoore Jr.]

I did manage to see Yes with Patrick Moraz twice; the first time was on his birthday in 1975 and an outdoor multi-band extravaganza in 1976. Dazzled me both times. My theory as to Howe's amazing guitar work on Relayer was that it was being written before Moraz joined and they were flirting with the idea that guitar synths (in their infancy at best) could carry the ball entirely. Then after Patrick signed on, it was a matter what to keep in the arrangements and what Patrick's keyboards should instead voice.

Hi Tim,

I am genuinely happy and also very jeleous that you saw YES several times on those tours. Also, please don't undersell that "multi-band" show you saw! Wasn't that tour with Gentle Giant or Gary Wright or Peter Frampton, depending on venue? Frampton was a heck of a show as well. Myself being much "younger" then you old geezers, I was lucky to sneak into MSG for the GFTO tour in 1977.
The concert era you witnessed(all the unregulated lasers & absolute musical virtuosity) the world will never see again.

:worthy

 

[timbre4]

Indeed. San Diego was Gentle Giant, Gary Wright, Peter Frampton and Yes.




From QQ deep space

 

[Almen]

I gave it a listen, and it is really, really shrill. It could also have been less compressed. But maybe atrocious was a bit exaggerated. Musically, it's quite extreme in many ways, for being yes. I really look forward to Sound Chaser in a clean surround mix.

In the analysis of Gates below, notice the "Allpassed crest factor", where the difference between the dotted and the continuous lines roughly indicates the amount of dynamic compression. Also, in the Normalized average spectrum", the bump between 1 kHz and 4-5 kHz shows an excessive amount of energy there.

 

[Ranasakawa]

I gave it a listen, and it is really, really shrill. It could also have been less compressed. But maybe atrocious was a bit exaggerated. Musically, it's quite extreme in many ways, for being yes. I really look forward to Sound Chaser in a clean surround mix.

In the analysis of Gates below, notice the "Allpassed crest factor", where the difference between the dotted and the continuous lines roughly indicates the amount of dynamic compression. Also, in the Normalized average spectrum", the bump between 1 kHz and 4-5 kHz shows an excessive amount of energy there.
View attachment 16015

What is the source of this audio file ?

 

[Almen]

What is the source of this audio file ?

It is George Marino 1994.

 

[knifeman]

Indeed. San Diego was Gentle Giant, Gary Wright, Peter Frampton and Yes.




From QQ deep space

I'm pissed! The Phila. show had the same lineup except The Pousette-Dart Band replaced Gentle Giant.

 

[knifeman]

I was pleasantly surprised to hear Relayer would be the next SW remix. The popular opinion seemed to be TFTO, which even to this long-time Yes fan was an underwhelming record. No matter how hard I tried, I just could never appreciate it; although I'll definitely buy it if/when it's released and hope the 5.1 treatment presents it in a totally different light. Now Relayer is another story. I always thought of this as a Steve Howe record; he just seems to dominate this album in a good way. But I agree with other comments regarding the sound quality on previous releases. Shrill is a good way to describe it and I'm hoping this remix does for it what the Aqualung remix did for that classic recording.

 

[Clint Eastwood]

For US customers this is a pretty good deal for the blu ray combo...free shipping but they do charge tax for some states HERE

 

[ssully]

I gave it a listen, and it is really, really shrill. It could also have been less compressed. But maybe atrocious was a bit exaggerated. Musically, it's quite extreme in many ways, for being yes. I really look forward to Sound Chaser in a clean surround mix.

In the analysis of Gates below, notice the "Allpassed crest factor", where the difference between the dotted and the continuous lines roughly indicates the amount of dynamic compression. Also, in the Normalized average spectrum", the bump between 1 kHz and 4-5 kHz shows an excessive amount of energy there.

For Relayer, I've been 'giving it a listen' since late 1974 and somehow, the supposed atrociousness and awful shrillness hasn't yet dissuaded me from doing so regularly.

Yes its true, Offord recorded this one hot and (analog) compression was used. That's 'the sound' he was going for

Marino might have added some compression on top of that. (Supposedly the go-to CD for this is the first one, mastered by Zal Schreiber....but from what I have seen of comparative analysis, what Marino mainly did was roll off some treble on the Zal mastering)

I hope Steve Wilson doesn't *de* compress parts so much that they lose power -- as he did with ELP's Tarkus.

 

[rtbluray]

Full content has been announced!

Besides the new mixes and the original master, both the DVD-A and Blu-Ray contain this 'Alternate Album':

1 THE GATES OF DELIRIUM – Studio run through
2 SOUND CHASER – Studio run through
3 TO BE OVER – Studio run through

BLU-RAY ONLY CONTENT

Additional Material:
1 SOON (single edit)
2 SOUND CHASER (single edit)
3 THE GATES OF DELIRIUM (Studio run through)

Blu-ray Exclusive: LPCM Stereo 24/96
1 SOUND CHASER – Live from Cobo Hall 1976
2 SOUND CHASER – demo version

Archived Master: LPCM Stereo 24/96
1 THE GATES OF DELIRIUM
2 SOUND CHASER
3 TO BE OVER

2014 Stereo Instrumental Mixes: LPCM Stereo 24/96
1 THE GATES OF DELIRIUM
2 SOUND CHASER
3 TO BE OVER

Needle-drop 1: A1/B1 UK vinyl transfer LPCM Stereo 24/96
1 THE GATES OF DELIRIUM
2 SOUND CHASER
3 TO BE OVER

Needle-drop 2: US promo album A1/B1 US vinyl transfer LPCM Stereo 24/96
1 THE GATES OF DELIRIUM (PART I)
2 (PART II)
3 (PART III)
4 SOUND CHASER (PART I)
5 SOUND CHASER (PART II)

The CD contains the 2014 stereo mix and the single edits of "Soon" and "Sound Chaser".

http://yesworld.com/2014/08/relayer-5-1-hi-res-stereo-remixed-expanded-steven-wilson-2014/

 

[blue.monk]

Thanks rt! That looks terrific. Glad to have instrumental mixes once again. I'm hoping SW can tame the distortion in 'Gates', assuming that it is an issue with the original stereo master and not the multis.

 

[blue.monk]