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HiRez Poll Yes - RELAYER [DVD-A/BluRay Audio]

Help Support QuadraphonicQuad:

Rate the DVD-A/BDA of Yes - RELAYER

  • 5 -

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • 4 -

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • 3 -

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • 2 -

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • 1 - Poor Surround, Poor Fidelity, Poor Contact

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    66

rtbluray

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edisonbaggins

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I really don't care for this album, i thought maybe iwould like it more in surround, but i just don't care fot it.
I hear you on this. This may well be my least-favorite of all Yes albums, and I really don't like some of the 80's/90's ones...
I'll keep it around for at least a few more listens, which likely means a few more years. hahaha

But yeah, I hope more and more of us try the QQ Swap Meet. At least it keeps the $$ "in the family."
 

par4ken

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I recently purchased this disc, I got the DVD-A as it was a bit cheaper than the BluRay. It's nice to see that format still supported, it must be about ten years now that they said DVD-A was a dead format. With the DVD-A you don't get the vinyl, needle drop if that's important to you. The DVD-A comes in a Digi-Pac instead of the mini LP sleeves of the BluRay. I would rate this album a bit lower than The Yes Album, Fragile and Close to the Edge but it's still quite good. Steven Wilson's mix is excellent, although a couple notches below that of the other releases. I'll give it an 8.
 

ssully

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I love this album, it's possibly my favorite Yes. It's absolutely brilliant. But Wilson did not ace the 2.0 and 5.1 remixes. He couldn't replicate some of the effects , I understand that, but worse, it just doesn't hold together as well for me. Same reaction as I had to his Close to the Edge, and I suspect it will be to his Tales as well.

Probably I love Offord's mixes too well. If Wilson had simply been able to exactly replicate every single thing Offord did, and enhance it, minus the tape noise and other generational/tape grunge, I'd have been happy. Is that asking so much? :D

(FWIW, I bought Relayer the week it first came appeared in record stores in the US...the first time I bought a Yes album 'brand new'.)
 

rtbluray

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Probably I love Offord's mixes too well. If Wilson had simply been able to exactly replicate every single thing Offord did, and enhance it, minus the tape noise and other generational/tape grunge, I'd have been happy. Is that asking so much? :D
Yes, it is. It's not really possible at all for a mixing engineer to mix something EXACTLY the same as another. There will always be at least some small differences and idiosyncrasies between the different mixes. Heck, even if Eddie Offord did the surround and stereo remixes himself, I doubt they would have come out sounding exactly 100% the same as they did in the 1970s.
I love the remix of "Relayer" for what it is. "Gates of Delirium" is largely improved, "To Be Over" has a lot of improvement too, and no amount of remixing could improve "Sound Chaser", but obviously that's my own opinion. Ymmv… ;)
 

rtbluray

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Joke, dude. Joke.

But why am I bothering, it's obvious you have no clue about the greatness of the Relayer original mix. Sound Chaser included. :D
Nah, I knew the original mix of "Relayer" pretty well before the remix came out, though obviously not as well as you do just because you were around when it came out, whereas I had to wait several more years before making my appearance into the world and then several more years after that until I actually started to listening to Yes, let alone "Relayer". ;)
But anyway, regarding "Sound Chaser", it's just not for me, and I thought the remix would make me appreciate it more, but it really didn't, and you know what? That's fine. I'm not necessarily going to like every piece of Yes music just cause it's by Yes.
I'm just happy having very good surround mixes of the two pieces of music off "Relayer" that I do really enjoy, and I play them a lot, almost as much as the other three Yes remixes. :)
 

JediJoker

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Can someone tell me the difference between the 24/192 "flat transfer" and 24/96 "archived master" of the original mix on the Blu-ray? Is there mastering applied to the 24/96 archive, or is it just an older flat transfer at a lower sample rate?
 

tlake6659

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Can someone tell me the difference between the 24/192 "flat transfer" and 24/96 "archived master" of the original mix on the Blu-ray? Is there mastering applied to the 24/96 archive, or is it just an older flat transfer at a lower sample rate?
One is from the original stereo master, the other archived master is from the reel to reel copy.
 

ssully

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As I now understand it: it's a transfer of the production master used for consumer reel-to-reel release (perhaps EQ'd specifically for that format. Though I don't see why that'd be necessary, unlike a vinyl production master.)
 

ssully

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Yup. -3dB dip in the 'archive master' at ~2500 compared to the 'flat master'; slight broad dip (-1dB max, in one channel) from 9kHz to 20kHz; weird opposite-direction dips/boost in r/l channel from ~400Hz down to 20 Hz.-- Wish I could do a screencap, it's most bizarre.
 
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davie

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Well, I've had the Blu-ray edition for many months now. Unlike TYA, Fragile, and CTTE, Relayer is not something I was familiar with either back in the day or since. I was not at all sure I liked either the sound or the music upon the first couple of listens but I was not deterred, knowing from past experience that with time the aha monent may come and, so, eventually it did. Gates is both delirious and amazing. In part I, Anderson spits out the lyrics like a Gatling gun, which takes awhile to get used to. If I recall, the studio run through was a bit slower and I don't think it helps to spit out complex lyrics at such a dizzying rate. The part II battle scene is incredibly exciting and intense as a piece of music while part III's Soon is one of the most beautiful pieces of popular music I have ever heard. It is nothing short of a spiritual experience. Sound Chaser seems like a kind of response to the jazz influenced work that King Crimson and Yes's former drummer Bill Bruford were doing at the time. At least that's my take. Steven Wilson's wizardry on the surround mix is nothing short of amazing. It's the most aggresssive surround experience I've had. Entirely in keeping with the material, it is a truly a triumph.

If that was all there was to say about Relayer it would be a 10. But as others have mentioned repeatedly, prior incarnations of this material have sounded mediocre or worse. The vocals on the US promo needle drop of Gates are incredibly harsh. It's almost like someone thought a little extra reverb would help solve the problem. The notes in the booklet state that Relayer was recorded at Chris Squire's home studio. Given the band's method of composing, this may have made sense but I suspect this is at the root of the problem in the sound quality. Though SW has certainly removed most of the harshness, no doubt it was simply not possible to remix the multi-tracks and have them sound sonically like TYA or Fragile, which were recorded in a real studio. In the remix, clarity and muddiness seem to coexist. The bass in particular seems muddled. It mostly seems to just hang there without much definition. Although the tonal balance is good the overall sound is not exactly what one could call high fidelity. Perhaps this is at the core of Anderson's stated disappointment with the album. It's certainly not the musicianship that's at fault.

So 3/3 for the incredible content, 2/3 for the so-so, albeit improved, fidelity, 3/3 for the amazing mix, and an extra point for the package as a whole. So a 9 overall for me.
 

ssully

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I wouldn't use a promo US needledrop as the comparative standard, as there's a flat transfer of the original masters on the set too, as well as flat transfer of the RTR production master. (And I might be more inclined to use the UK needledrop over the US promo too)

I don't know what SW did, but a fast A/B shows his two-channel remix to be so much less sparkling than the original mix that I wonder if some too-heavy NR was applied to the multitrack stems before mixing, to chop down hiss. "clarity and muddiness seem to coexist" is a good way to put it, though to my ears, too much of the latter. That's one of the reason it just doesn't hang together for me as the original mix does.


 
D

davie

Guest
Honestly, I've not listened to the stereo remix. With SW's surround mixes I rarely feel the need. I only used the US promo as a comparison because I was curious what it would sound like and no doubt whatever LP I would have got here in the States - had I got one at the time - would have sounded no better and I am sure I would have been sorely disappointed. Whether its the UK or US promo needledrops, the EQ applied in the mastering process is a far cry from the flat transfers used in the SW mixes. Of course too much NR will definitely ruin any remastered album, a mistake which is not that uncommon. But too much energy at the high end is an even more common mistake and to me an ear-bleeding insult at that. I'm happy to take a more slightly subdued flat mix.
 

Daniel John

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Somewhat disappointed in this DVD-A release especially after hearing Close to the Edge and Fragile blu-ray audio. To be honest I had not heard Relayer before and wasn't prepared for the material. There is some decent music on the album but this is Yes trying be more jazz-fusion than the pioneering prog-rock they are known for. Both the DTS and 2014 surround mix are weak and thin sounding especially when compared to the excellent mixes on Close to the Edge and Fragile. I did not focus on the stereo mix.
In a nut shell , this one wasn't worth what I paid for it and overall not up to par with what I was expecting. I gave it a 5.
 
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wavelength

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Somewhat disappointed in this DVD-A release especially after hearing Close to the Edge and Fragile blu-ray audio. To be honest I had not heard Relayer before and wasn't prepared for the material. There is some decent music on the album but this is Yes trying be more jazz-fusion than prog-rock that they are known for. Both the DTS and 2014 surround mix are weak and thin sounding especially when compared to the excellent mixes on Close to the Edge and Fragile. Wasn't worth what I paid for it and overall not up to par. I gave it a 5.
At first I didn't know what to make of it but I eventually learned to like Relayer after several listens.
 
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